When we last spoke to boxing great George Foreman in 2003 he told us about the amazing, life-changing experience he had in 1977 after his big match with boxer Jimmy Young. While in the locker room after the fight--which he lost--he said he had died and gone to a dark place from which he was ultimately rescued by the grace of God. Shortly after that incident, he gave his life over to God and became a Christian minister. Now he has a new memoir, "God In My Corner" which explores his spiritual transformation and the dark period of his life before he experienced God's grace (he had considered hiring hit men to kill his enemies). Foreman also says that the "Rumble in the Jungle"—the 1974 fight in Zaire in which he lost his heavyweight title to Muhammad Ali--was one of the best things that ever happened to him.
Although Foreman is said to have made over $150 million from his popular line of grills, he continues to preach, as he has for years, at The Church of Lord Jesus Christ in Houston, Texas, and is currently a judge on ABC's "American Inventor." He spoke to Beliefnet recently about reading the Bible with Muhammad Ali, his favorite answered prayer, and whether he'll be making another comeback to boxing. After you finish reading the interview, click through our gallery of personal photos from George Foreman.
George Foreman and Muhammad Ali read the Bible together in 1984. Click on the photo to view more from Foreman's personal collection.
I wish I knew where in the world that place is. All I can tell you is that I would never want to go back there. It was just complete emptiness and darkness. If you multiply every sad thought you've ever had in your life, you wouldn't come close to this dump yard. That's where I was—just dead. And nothingness where I was, just nothing.
You said that you were interested in several religions before you became a Christian and that you toyed with the idea of becoming Muslim like Muhammad Ali [who took Foreman's heavyweight title in a bout in
I thought about [Islam], but one day I tore [Ali's] jacket off of him, being the mean guy that I am, and he cussed me out so bad. And I said, "Wow! I'm like that already." So, I left [Islam] alone.
And then I admired [David Carradine] from the [1970s television series] "Kung Fu." He looked Buddhist or something. I don't know what he was. He just looked so cool—and that karate. And he could stop [doing that] and meditate. And I thought about that [religion], too.
He had gone on the Dick Cavett Show, he and the girl he was staying with [actress Barbara Hershey]. And she just took out her breast right there on national television! He's there watching them, as [she] breastfed their child. He just looked so tacky. I said, "That's the end of that thought. I don't want that religion, either."
When I was in that dressing room [after the fight withYoung], down on that floor, blood on my hand and forehead, screaming that Jesus Christ was coming alive in me, I wasn't interested in any religion. [But] from that point on, I started reciting the Bible, talking from the pit of my stomach, in that dressing room. [I was] talking about how Jesus was God's son and that he was alive. So when I came out of that, I asked a friend to go get me a Bible. And he said, "What kind?" And I said, "I don't know. One like your mother has." So, he went out and bought me a King James version of the Bible. And that's how I got into religion.
Before you became a believer, your advisors had suggested you clean up your bad-guy image by speaking at churches. I’m curious what you would talk about then, since it didn't seem like you knew a lot about Christianity or the Bible.
Didn't know anything at all. As a matter of fact, after I lost to Ali, I was trying to get people to get on my bandwagon so I could really get a movement to get a title match. And a friend said that there was a church in
So, I got there, and I asked the guy who ran the church, his name was Dr. [Robert] Schuller [now pastor of the Crystal Cathedral in
So Dr. Schuller, as a matter of fact, when I had [my religious] experience, was the first one I called. And I told him what had happened to me. I said, "Look, I’m not playing, man. Jesus is really alive." He said, "I believe you, George." I said, "I'm serious, man! When I spoke at your church, I didn't know what I was talking about." He said, "I believe you."
After you found God, you started preaching on street corners, and it actually led to you becoming close with your father, whom you didn't have a good relationship with. Was that a coincidence?
Isn't that the strangest thing in the world? When I [started going to church], there were so many preachers there. They'd let me tell [my] testimony, but I didn't get a chance to preach much. One kid said to me, "George, I know how you can preach. Let's go on the street corners." I [began] traveling from one street corner to another, three-fourths through
The next week he was in church. And he said to my mother, "You know, something's happened to that boy. I got to find out what it is." He never took another drink. We [would go] to church as brothers--he called me the preacher, and he was Brother Foreman—until the day he died.
How difficult was it to come back to the ring after being a preacher?
The punching bag used to be the fellow I was going to fight. I could just see that bag—see [my opponent] in the bag— and tear the bag up. But, after the experience [in 1977], I went to a punching bag, and it was just rags and leather. I just couldn't concentrate like that anymore. So, I left boxing for 10 years.
I started a youth center in
But isn't it hard to throw a punch without being nervous that you might inflict pain on someone else?
No. It would be hard to throw a punch to someone who wasn't a boxer, who wasn't in the ring, and who didn't have on a pair of boxing gloves and who hadn't been training.
[When I'd be with] other athletes [after I found God], we'd get in the ring and hit one another in the eye and laugh, "I got you that time!" And they'd just say, "I'll get you next time." There was never a punch in anger. We'd hug before the fights and afterwards.
Before you found God, you were a very angry person and even wanted to hire a hit man to kill people who had wronged you, but you discovered forgiveness. How did you find it in your heart to forgive all of the people who had hurt you?
There were people who were going behind my back and told lies, who had stolen money [from me]. One person after another. It got to be so many people on my list to get even with and hurt, there were too many people to hire a hit man. I was thinking, "How am I going to get all these people?" I was so angry. I would just sit there and steam and [wonder] how could I get rid of these people.
But when I found God after my experience with Jesus Christ, and I saw this place—this big nothing that I was in, I [realized that] I had not found an enemy in this world that I would wish to go to this place. I instantly stopped hating anyone.
As a matter of act, I called all my friends whom I'd mistreated, and asked their forgiveness. I hugged people who really considered themselves my enemies, to let them know there was nothing they had done to me that meant anything. I found peace of mind.
Would there ever be a circumstance where you wouldn't be able to forgive someone?
Oh, not in this life now. I've found my peace of mind. If you wake up one morning without forgiveness in your heart, you'll wake up without children, without a husband, without a wife. Forgiveness is the only way that you can bind love and friendship. Without it, you are empty.
I am so happy to be alive. That's the one thing I'd like for people to know. Sometimes people walk by and slip up and say the wrong thing about me, and I'll smile. They wonder why am I smiling. Because I’m happy that I’m alive.
Tell me a little about your relationship with Muhammad Ali now. Do you feed off of each other spiritually?
In the past he was one of the fellows that I truly didn't like. I really hated him. He took my title, never gave me a title shot. But, when I found Jesus Christ, the first thing that came to my mind was to make sure I shared my experience with Muhammed Ali. And over the years we became the best of friends. We're signing notes, "I love you. George." "I love you. Muhammed." If he had two dollars, and you asked him [for it], he would conceal that it was his last two dollars and give it to you. We're great friends. I love him.
There's a photo in the book of you and Ali in 1984 reading the Bible together. Would you often read and discuss the Bible with him?
Every time I saw him, to the point that he'd hide. "Stop it. Stop it, George!" Just like he would run his mouth to opponents, I was running my mouth to him about the Bible—always pointing out a Bible scripture. He told me, "Just let me alone." But I loved that. That was my greatest experience, explaining and showing him things in the Bible.
Did he try to discuss the Qur'an with you?
Tell us about your favorite answered prayer.
The one prayer that I'll always be grateful for [involved] my nephew, George Edward Dumas. He was literally dying and was in a coma. When I first got the phone call in the middle of the night, I got on my knees for the first time and prayed hard, saying that I'd give up my wealth. I said, "If there's a God, take my life and let that boy live." Then I went to sleep. The next week, that boy was walking around as normal. Now he's over 300 pounds and almost 6'7"
Will you ever return to boxing?
Oh, no! When I was 55, I was going to do it, but my wife put her foot down, and said, "No way!"--after I'd already made press conferences and announcements. I said, "Don't you believe in me? You don't think I can do it? I can still do it." She said, "Isn't that the way you want to leave the sport, George?"
What's your favorite thing about being a Christian?
My chance to have a second chance to live. I found out that the greatest thing in the world—the greatest existence of anything—is that God made us human beings, and that I found out how to love my fellow man. I don't think it's possible for anyone to truly appreciate human beings' lives until they've found Jesus Christ.