Virtual Talmud

Virtual Talmud


The Shanda of Intolerance

posted by mkress

Life takes precedence under Jewish law, and the gay-rights advocates cannot be faulted for bowing to security concerns and canceling the gay rights parade slated for Jerusalem this weekend. But the State of Israel did wrong in letting it come to this and not cracking down on the violence sooner.

This is not the first time Orthodox violence has effectively curbed diversity in Jerusalem. For years, women who wanted to pray together at the Western Wall, the Kotel, were submitted to attacks while the police did little to protect them. They were not doing anything so very radical. They were following Jewish law, at least according to liberal Orthodox rabbis.

The canceling of the parade is so sad because the threat of violence has again won out. I worry what this caving in will do in the long run. Will the haredi feel empowered and resort to more violence over the next demand? This is exactly how radical religious fundamentalists took control in other countries. I thought Israel was different, holding its radical fringe in check.

What a shanda–a shameful thing–that it should come to this in the Jewish State. Have we already forgotten that Jews and gays shared the same fate in Nazi gas chambers? You’d think we, of all people, would have learned the necessity of tolerance.

The Associate Press reported that Rabbi Yosef Elnikaveh, a prominent religious leader, said allowing the parade to proceed was surrendering to “mental illness.” The mufti of Jerusalem, Mohammed Hussein, the top Muslim cleric in the Palestinian territories, said being gay is a crime and demanded police punish those involved in the parade. Christian evangelical groups in Jerusalem have called the parade “provocative” and demanded the venue be changed. It is nice to hear that three major religious leaders agree on something. Too bad it is about promoting bias against others.

–Posted by Rabbi Susan Grossman



Advertisement
Comments read comments(10)
post a comment
Terissa

posted November 11, 2006 at 5:56 pm


You shock me that you are a rabbai a so called man of the true and living GOD, this has nothing to do with the Nazis but the fact of what Isreal stand for. God distroyed a whole nation because of this nasty behavior and he does not tolerate it today. You are the apple of Gods’ eye and this is how you would disrespect his ways. Yes the people should not have resorted to violent acts this I agree with but the fact still stand homosexuality is moraly wrong and for a people to accept it because the feel that everyone should live how they want to live but their are rules in this life and that is the word of God and the history of his actions behind it. Look at your nation why it is always at war because of the sins of your fathers disobey God by adapting pagan habits.



report abuse
 

David

posted November 12, 2006 at 6:10 pm


If intolerance is a shanda how about an inability to add, or more specifically an unwillingless to be fruitful and multiplying instead of being fruity and childless.



report abuse
 

HARDEN

posted November 12, 2006 at 10:14 pm


I AM DISGUSTED WITH YOUR ULTRA LIBERAL AND EMPTY VALUES. A.JUST BECAUSE YOU HAVE RECIEVED A SO CALLED SEMICHA YOU CAN NOT BECOME A RABBI .B. THE WHOLE ISSUE OF HOMOSEXUALITY IS AGAINST ALL JEWISH LAWS. AND TO PROMOTE THEM AND GIVE THEM CREDANCE WHICH THEY CAN COME AND MARCH IN THE MOST HOLLIEST CITY IN THE WORLD IS ABSOLUTLETY REPOGNANT. AND FOR YOU TO BACK THEM IS SHAMEFULL. MAY THAT IS WHY WE HAVE PEOPLE LIKE THEM AND LIKE YOU IMMORAL THAT MASHIECH HAS NOT APPEARED.



report abuse
 

HARDEN

posted November 12, 2006 at 10:14 pm


I AM DISGUSTED WITH YOUR ULTRA LIBERAL AND EMPTY VALUES. A.JUST BECAUSE YOU HAVE RECIEVED A SO CALLED SEMICHA YOU CAN NOT BECOME A RABBI .B. THE WHOLE ISSUE OF HOMOSEXUALITY IS AGAINST ALL JEWISH LAWS. AND TO PROMOTE THEM AND GIVE THEM CREDANCE WHICH THEY CAN COME AND MARCH IN THE MOST HOLLIEST CITY IN THE WORLD IS ABSOLUTLETY REPOGNANT. AND FOR YOU TO BACK THEM IS SHAMEFULL. MAY THAT IS WHY WE HAVE PEOPLE LIKE THEM AND LIKE YOU IMMORAL THAT MASHIECH HAS NOT APPEARED.



report abuse
 

Espiritus85

posted November 13, 2006 at 1:02 am


Sure David, childlessness is your concern. Keep telling yourself that.



report abuse
 

Espiritus85

posted November 13, 2006 at 1:02 am


Sure David, childlessness is your concern. Keep telling yourself that.



report abuse
 

Dave

posted November 13, 2006 at 6:31 pm


Childlessness shoould be every Jew’s concern. There used to be a Christian sect called the Shakers. They had very few children as they preferred conversion as oppposed to fecundity as a way of staying around. Now all that’s left of them is literally the furniture they made not the chldren they didn’t. If 6 Jewish couples had 10 children each, and each descendant also had 10 children in 6 generations there would be 6 million Jews as a result. Interesting number, no?



report abuse
 

Dave

posted November 13, 2006 at 6:31 pm


Childlessness shoould be every Jew’s concern. There used to be a Christian sect called the Shakers. They had very few children as they preferred conversion as oppposed to fecundity as a way of staying around. Now all that’s left of them is literally the furniture they made not the chldren they didn’t. If 6 Jewish couples had 10 children each, and each descendant also had 10 children in 6 generations there would be 6 million Jews as a result. Interesting number, no?



report abuse
 

Chana Silverman

posted November 16, 2006 at 8:41 pm


Whoa – lets not get soooo angry! I believe in tolerance becasue “gay-bashing” has never influenced anyone to change. Yet at the same time perverseness is a “Shanda”. The challenge is to express acceptance of the person without condoning the behavior. To love with out judgment, which belongs to HaShem; However, I think gay pride stuff is an “in your face” display and encourages confrontation. If no one showed up to watch their parades but them maybe their childish attention getting displays would tone down. I suspect they want approval and to validate the gay life when deep, deep inside they must know it is a sin. I think they are trapped in their own pleasure zones and have made perverson a “golden calf”. They need our pity and our prayers. They are missing out on a truly fullfilling life. We are all guilty of exaulting our animal nature at one time or another. It is a Shanda when we forget this house of flesh that can bring us so much pleasure is destined for the worms eventually. I have always wondered what makes child molestors and gay people tick. What force is driving them to even deny G-d is watching and G-d cares? It must be horrific to be controled by a sex drive driven in a harmful and wrong direction. When HaShem created us to have so much beauty in a sex life within His boundries it makes me believe in the possibility of “demons holding in bondage” when His creation chooses another way.



report abuse
 

Chana Silverman

posted November 16, 2006 at 8:41 pm


Whoa – lets not get soooo angry! I believe in tolerance becasue “gay-bashing” has never influenced anyone to change. Yet at the same time perverseness is a “Shanda”. The challenge is to express acceptance of the person without condoning the behavior. To love with out judgment, which belongs to HaShem; However, I think gay pride stuff is an “in your face” display and encourages confrontation. If no one showed up to watch their parades but them maybe their childish attention getting displays would tone down. I suspect they want approval and to validate the gay life when deep, deep inside they must know it is a sin. I think they are trapped in their own pleasure zones and have made perverson a “golden calf”. They need our pity and our prayers. They are missing out on a truly fullfilling life. We are all guilty of exaulting our animal nature at one time or another. It is a Shanda when we forget this house of flesh that can bring us so much pleasure is destined for the worms eventually. I have always wondered what makes child molestors and gay people tick. What force is driving them to even deny G-d is watching and G-d cares? It must be horrific to be controled by a sex drive driven in a harmful and wrong direction. When HaShem created us to have so much beauty in a sex life within His boundries it makes me believe in the possibility of “demons holding in bondage” when His creation chooses another way.



report abuse
 

Post a Comment

By submitting these comments, I agree to the beliefnet.com terms of service, rules of conduct and privacy policy (the "agreements"). I understand and agree that any content I post is licensed to beliefnet.com and may be used by beliefnet.com in accordance with the agreements.



Previous Posts

The Task Is Never Finished
It has been heartwarming to read the warm responses to Rabbi Waxman's post asking Beliefnet to reconsider its decision to cancel Virtual Talmud. Virtual Talmud offered an alternative model for internet communications: civil discourse pursued in postings over a time frame of days (rather than moments

posted 12:31:46pm Apr. 03, 2008 | read full post »

Some Parting Reflections
Well, loyal readers, all good things must come to an end and we’ve been informed that this particular experiment in blogging as a forum for creating wide-ranging discussion on topics of interest to contemporary Jews has run its course. Maybe it’s that blogging doesn’t lend itself so well to t

posted 1:00:29pm Mar. 31, 2008 | read full post »

Obama's Lesson and The Jewish Community
There are few times in this blog’s history when I have felt that Rabbi Grossman was one hundred percent correct in her criticisms of my ideas. However, a few weeks ago she called me out for citing a few crack websites on Barak Obama’s advisors. She was right. I never should have cited those web

posted 12:09:08pm Mar. 31, 2008 | read full post »

The Future of Race Relations
As a post-baby boomer, it is interesting to me to see how much of today’s conversation about racial relations is still rooted in the 1960s experience and rhetoric of the civil rights struggle, and the disenchantment that followed. Many in the black and Jewish communities look to this period either

posted 4:04:41pm Mar. 25, 2008 | read full post »

Wright and Wrong of Race and Jews
Years ago, as a rabbinical student, I was one of a group of rabbinical students who visited an African American seminary in Atlanta. My fellow rabbinical students and I expected an uplifting weekend of interfaith sharing like we had experienced in visits to other (largely white) seminaries. We were

posted 12:50:11pm Mar. 24, 2008 | read full post »




Report as Inappropriate

You are reporting this content because it violates the Terms of Service.

All reported content is logged for investigation.