The Jazz Theologian

The Jazz Theologian


Best argument against the existence of God

posted by Robert Gelinas

I believe in God.  

I’ve given my life to him and hope, pray and work so that others will too.  That said, in the new book that I’m writing, there is a section with my best argument against the existence of God.  I’ll share it with you in a later post.
I’m curious about you.  Are you an atheist?  If so, what was the argument that solidified your non-beleif?  Are you a believer like me?  If you to reach deep inside to that place where your doubts reside, what question do you have?  Even if you weren’t persuaded, what is the most compelling argument against the existence of God that you have heard?  


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JustGuessing

posted March 17, 2011 at 3:52 pm


I’m not an atheist but here area the reasons I’ve heard why people don’t believe in God.
1. How can a loving God allow so much suffering?
2. If God is all powerfully can’t he just prove he exists once and for all?
3. A literal reading of any religious text can easily be proven untrue.
4. The evil that has been done in the name of God.
5. Cannot find a place in evolution where God is intervening.
6. Science seems to be the best way of answering the big questions. For example why is there something instead of nothing?



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wanda

posted March 24, 2011 at 10:14 am


I donot have a question, I just have an answer that God is so real!



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Blargoplork

posted March 24, 2011 at 1:44 pm


Wanda, thank you so much for completely missing the point of Robert Gelinas’ post.

Some reasons to at least question the logic behind the Christian god:

1. God could instantly resolve all religious disputes everywhere (and probably all war and conflict) just by making his/her/its existence known on planet Earth right now. Why doesn’t he/she/it? I have heard all of the normal responses to this. “God wants his followers to rely on faith, not reason!” Um, why? God risks the majority of his ‘beloved’ humans burning in the bowels of hell forever because of this insistence on sticking with this faith system. “God wants us to have total free will! You wouldn’t want it any other way!” Really? What is the value of this free will if the end result is an eternity of gargling molten rock? I personally would much rather be a happy, but largely mindless, puppet in heaven then have a free will and be forced to endure mind bending torture because I had some “bad” thoughts during life. There are more non-answers to the why-doesn’t-God-show-himself question, but this is getting wordy…

2. All followers of all religions have members who claim to have been contacted by their version of God/gods/Buddha’s karmic echo/whatever. They are all mutually exclusive belief systems, so they can’t all be right. So how do you know that your favored God figure is the correct one? All of these other worldly experiences are filled with love/light/wisdom/other traits associated with divinity. What makes the Christian/Islamic/whatever experience more “true” than every one else’s?

3. The origin stories of all of the world’s major religions miss the mark pretty badly. Why? Wouldn’t God/Zeus/Odin/Shiva know how their universe evolved? I’m kind of willing to give this one a bit of a pass because stories like Genesis are probably just allegories created by bronze age story tellers to teach lessons. Still, an awful lot of modern believers take them literally, so they make it harder for outsiders to swallow the belief systems they advocate.



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Dave H

posted March 29, 2011 at 10:04 pm


I am not an atheist. However, I have never heard of any arguments against the existence of our Heavenly Father.

All I have heard are people asking where is God when there are some bad things happening either in their lives or around the world.

I don’t think anyone can come up with solid statements against the existence of God.

Dave



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Steve Whitt

posted April 5, 2011 at 6:42 pm


First, I don’t write to offend. I believe life is for learning, so I want to learn. I really do desire an answer.

I don’t believe in God for the same reason I don’t believe in Vishnu, Allah, Zeus, or any other supernatural being. I’ve looked for reasoned responses to my stance, and I’ve yet to find anything that comes close to helping me even appreciate your viewpoint. God has all the hallmarks of a made-up story (including the bit about belief requiring faith – how convenient!), so until proven otherwise, that’s what God is to me.

Here are some arguments that won’t work.

1) Something rather than nothing. I’ve studied a lot of cosmology and I can categorically say that scientists don’t know – yet. But there are lots of interesting ideas, not one of which requires or even is friendly toward supernatural intervention. Saying God did it does nothing for me, so don’t try.

2) Please don’t use the Bible to prove God’s existence. Of course the Bible accepts the existence of God, in the same way that the Odyssey accepts the existence of Athene. Bible prophecies must be “interpreted”, which means they don’t make clear, unambiguous predictions, but instead only look like predictions when interpreted after the fact. Not convincing.

3) Please don’t go the “liar, lunatic, or lord” route. Consider it from my point of view. The stories are made up, so of course the writers could put anything they want into the hero’s words. That doesn’t mean anyone ever said such a thing. Writers make things up all the time.

Scientists can point to the world, give me a reasoned argument, and convince me of some pretty wild things – for instance, an electron is both a particle and a wave, the atoms of my body were born in a giant exploding star, a white door is actually reflecting not white, but every color of the rainbow. Now it’s your turn. Point to the world, give me a reasoned argument, and show me why you believe in God.

Or don’t. You’re under no obligation, of course. Thanks for reading.



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c jones

posted April 14, 2011 at 7:54 pm


Check out truelife.org



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Steve Whitt

posted April 14, 2011 at 10:30 pm


c jones

Thanks for writing. The only thing I can see on the site that seems to be trying to convince an atheist like me is this page:

http://truelife.org/home/category_article_list_show?article=8&status=article

Yet these are the cosmological arguments. I’m just not moved by them. We simply don’t know how the universe came to be. How does “we don’t know” translate to “God exists”? Why? It’s like saying I don’t know what’s under the bed, so there must be a unicorn there.

The anthropic principle, while interesting, is not an argument for God. Suppose we found ourselves in a universe where human life were impossible. THAT would be evidence for God, since the laws of physics would have to be suspended for us to be here. The fact that the laws of physics allow us to exist is of course a given – because clearly we do exist. Why is it surprising to find ourselves in such a universe?

OK, so what did I miss on the website that either argues something other than the three failed arguments I listed above, or else argues something different that might be more convincing?



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SoulBro

posted May 4, 2011 at 5:38 pm


(trying a second time, first comment did not seem to appear… don’t sensor me y’all please)

On(Whether): (Does) God exist(s).

The power of god, further, the power of Christ, is in whether or not a person believes or not. Not in whether the belief or “story” is actually true or can be proved.
It does not matter whether god exists or not. The existence of god, at least today, is secured or achieved by faith. The existence of god depends upon what a person sees in the world and how they interpret what they see in the world and in themselves. Faith, belief, is what “proves” the existence of god. There have even been those who say they have “seen god”, even in the midst of others and the others present have not seen the same thing or they have seen nothing at all.

In Matthew Ch17 v17-20 the saviour is not talking about what is in the world, what you can “touch” with your hands or “see” with your eyes. Jesus’ parable is about faith, the idea of “to believe” and he admonishes his disciples thusly. The mustard seed is tiny, incomprehensible, to the mountain. The issue of whether god is “real” (exists) or not is not a question that can be answered by science and therefore by the practical actions of humanity. Those detered from believing in faith or the power of belief because “god does not exist” are selling themselves short. In what we know as life, whether it be from god, or not, one of the most if not the most powerful transforming things found in us is faith, our ability to believe and commit our will, our lives and our existence to what we want, what we feel in our hearts. We extend this to include not only what is already “in the world” but further to what we desire “to be in the world”. This faith, this “to believe”, in effect creates the world as it is to us. To carry the point, god is “made real” most importantly in us, if at all, and the power of faith, “to believe”, is the “power” of god in our lives.



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L Taylor

posted September 23, 2011 at 4:50 pm


We believe because we believe? Ok end of
argument. You ignore the most wonderous
aspect of your being-your brain. Some would call it being brain -washed,others would call
it being condition or programed,like a robot.
A skeptic



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lanny Taylor

posted October 3, 2011 at 6:33 pm


Being an academic I go to the source. Says who
is my guiding principle.First the old testament
was written, 5,000 years after these events
supposedly occurred,by whom we do not know.
These stories were handed down through the ages
by ignorant people who didn’t know the earth was round or any thing about geology,cosmology,storms
psychology,dreams etc. etc. etc.These were
superstitious tribal people who believed in
the dreams and visions of their leaders.



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