Pushing Past Terror to Understanding

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It was, I believe, an unprecedented and very meaningful step. Seventy-five percent of all Spanish mosques got together and said enough is enough. We ought to excommunicate Bin Laden, who is the arch symbol of the ideology of terrorism, from our midst, and we ought to do it in the language he understands, the language that his followers understand, the language of Islam. And they issued that fatwah, and declared him an apostate.

On Sunday, in the Times of London, I have an op-ed, which calls for the Muslim community in England to issue a fatwah against Bin Laden, with the idea that the perpetrators of the bombings in London will understand that they are hereby excommunicated religiously.

Akbar Ahmed: Judea has raised an important issue about legitimacy. The problem is that we are translating from one culture into another. In Muslim culture, there is no such thing as [universal] excommunication. So a fatwah, or no fatwah, does not mean anything to anyone outside that particular sectarian boundary. A Shi'a fatwah means nothing to the Sunnis. A second problem is this: The condemnation of Osama bin Laden has been issued. All the important sheikhs did condemn him as they condemned what happened on 9/11. It wasn't heard here [in the U.S. media]; people said it wasn't reported. But there was no question, it was completely unequivocal, there was condemnation. As far as the London bombings are concerned, I've been following the media, all the major organizations-including the Muslim Council of Britain-have loudly, unequivocally condemned what happened.

The business of all the imams issuing fatwahs, again has some limited value. I think, Judea, you are simply giving them far more importance than they have in real life.

Judea Pearl: Here is the quote from our friend Sir Iqbal Sacranie [Secretary-General of the Muslim Council of Britain]. He said that nothing in Islam can ever justify the evil actions of the bombers. Further, he added, that the criminals needed to be distanced from the Islamic faith. And now is the turn of the Muslim clerics in Britain to issue a religiously formulated excommunication or condemnation. They can call him

or a heretic, but there are formal methods within Islam that are available for such condemnation.

Why do I insist on the religious formulation? Not so much for the perpetrator, because he has already made his decision and chosen his mission in life. But for the thousands of potential recruits, who are currently on the verge of joining or not joining that culture [of terrorism]. It's very important for them to know that here are the leaders of their religion, at least in Britain, who condemn it in the language in which they have been educated, that this is a sin against God. Not only against man, or against a political institution, but against God. And God is going to be punishing them, and Osama bin Laden will be going to hell and not to paradise. This difference is very important, I believe, to the people who are on the verge of that decision.

Akbar Ahmed: Judea, the Muslim Council of Britain represents all the major Islamic organizations of Britain, all the major Islamic centers-that is exactly what you need. Not some obscure imam in Britain issuing a fatwah, because the Muslim community, the young men, are going to be looking to the major organizations like the Muslim Council of Britain. That is why I am pleased that the Muslim Council of Britain has taken a very clear, unambiguous reaction to this [attack on 7/7].

Judea Pearl: Indeed, very clear, and empowering, especially to us, who are concerned about possible backlash. Absolutely.

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