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Schuller Says He Wouldn’t Have OK’d Church’s Gay Covenant

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(RNS) Crystal Cathedral founder Robert H. Schuller said Wednesday (March 16) he never would have approved a recent covenant that choir members were asked to sign urging them to be Christian and heterosexual.
“I have a reputation worldwide of being tolerant of all people and their views,” Schuller told The Orange County Register. “I’m too well-educated to criticize a certain religion or group of people for what they believe in. It’s called freedom.”
The covenant describes choir members as people who confess Jesus as their savior, consider the Bible “authoritative and infallible,” and understand the cathedral’s position that marriage is “between one man and one woman.”
Schuller told the newspaper he agrees with the covenant’s stance on homosexuality but “that doesn’t mean that we are going to start a crusade against homosexuals.”
In a Tuesday statement on its website, the Southern California church, now led by his daughter and senior pastor Sheila Schuller Coleman, described the covenant as an attempt to explain expectations of ministry leaders. It apologized to those that might be hurt by its language.
Another daughter told the newspaper the elder Schuller is bound to sometimes differ with church leaders. “But, the organization and his voice are no longer seamless,” said Carol Schuller Milner. “It can never go back to being that way.”
The dispute is the latest controversy for the Garden Grove, Calif., church, which filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection in October and saw the 2008 resignation of Schuller’s son, Robert A. Schuller, as senior pastor.
- ADELLE M. BANKS, Religion News Service



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Henrietta22

posted March 17, 2011 at 8:44 pm


The covenant was only for ministry expectation, incl. Choir members. Schuller told the newspaper he agrees with the covennant’s stance on homosexuality but “that doesn’t mean that we are going to start a crusade against homosexuals”. If Schuller wouldn’t have ok’d the covenant, as he says, why wouldn’t he have, when he agrees with it? And why would any homosexual person feel at home in the Crystal Church now? Why would any homosexual person in the congregation feel at home there now? I’m straight and I wouldn’t.



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cknuck

posted March 18, 2011 at 1:13 am


Very good response by Schuller he is allowed his beliefs and he allows others to believe as they would. The one constance is homosexuality and God is incompatible. People want what they want and they know that God hates sin so they try to legislate homosexuality as not being sinful.



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nnmns

posted March 18, 2011 at 10:31 am


cknuck if “God hates sin” and you surely acknowledge being sinful shouldn’t you give serious thought to not casting any stones?



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Gwyddion9

posted March 18, 2011 at 12:24 pm


And what about the rest of the prohibitions in Leviticus? I’m sure this is what they’re using to base their decision, like most.
I see it as another pick and choose argument.
Lets face it, in the conservative Christian world, the only two issue one hears from them is either homosexuality or abortion. It’s funny how they’re so quiet about everything else.



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nnmns

posted March 18, 2011 at 2:46 pm


They only pick on things they (often falsely, I’m sure) think won’t affect them.



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Woodswalker3

posted March 18, 2011 at 3:18 pm


cknuck, I have no problem with anyone espousing their own viewpoints. I would just like pastors, preachers and anyone in a position of spiritual authority to take a minute and think about what their viewpoint leads to when delivered from the pulpit.
These “men of god” can plant seeds of hate in the souls and minds of their congregations. After all, if my preacher says gays are sinners and an abomination, perhaps it is not only OK, but mandated by the church to deny gay Americans access to all the rights of heterosexuals. Perhaps it’s OK to single them out for ridicule or worse, violence.
I think bigotry, when couched in biblical terms and presented by a person who has authority in the eyes of his “flock,” is the worst type. It causes grievous harm not only to gay folks, but to otherwise well-meaning and decent people.
Substitute the word “jew” or “African American” for “gay” the next time you hear anyone preaching against people who are created by God to be homosexual. And please – no more claims that sexuality is a “lifestyle” someone chooses. Who would choose to live life as a second class citizen, subject to bullying and denied basic human rights? I always wonder, if homosexuality is a choice, is that also true of heterosexuality? Think about it. When did you choose to be straight? Didn’t it just come naturally? Weren’t you just born that way?
I have hope that one day the way we treat our fellow gay Americans will be relegated to the sad and painful history of the way we treated other minorities. I really trust and believe that it will be so one day soon.



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GHUD

posted March 18, 2011 at 4:57 pm


Hello, just thought I would add in on the side of cknuck. I think there are huge flaws in what you are saying here woodswalker3. Your worst point was when you said that people are born homosexual then compared that to being a jew or black. The later to are both physical heritable traits and the former is a choice. Your way of proving your point was simply to say that we never made the choice to be hetersexual. Well, there is evidence both ways. People are born, naturally, wanting females. This involves a slew of hormones and visual stimuli that we are born with. These are the obvious biological facts. That is not to say that people can’t be born with scewed biological presets. I say scewed because if God made man to be joined with women, then a man with a man or women with women must be a mess up of the origional created people.
Basically, God made it one way and we see that people are doing it another. Either way, one way is sinful and one way is not. Plain and simple. That doesnt mean I go and commit sinfull acts (like violence). Unlike the koran and other religious materials, the bible prevents this violence you believe will occur. If a christian does violence to a homosexual, the christian community can rest assured that he is not backed by holy scripture.
A homosexual must admit his sin to God and fight with his unatural urges as best he can. That sounds terrible to someone who isn’t a christian or maybe simmply isnt following Gods law, but to a Christian who is saved and has, at times, experienced what it is like to live like God created us to, will know that the joy of prevailing in these battles can be amazing.
A drunk has to battle not to drink every night but in the end, the joy, standard of living, and spiritual revival he or she experiences will be amazing. Although, the Christian Road is not allways an easy road. It is often very difficult to live a true christian life. This issue is just another battle. The act of homosexuality is a sin. Accepting it in your life as an honest value is a sin. Having urges for the same sex is not a sin if you fight them and do not pursue them. Satan allways tries to temp us. Praise the Lord for his grace in our lives to not fall into the pits of life.



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GHUD

posted March 18, 2011 at 4:58 pm


Hello, just thought I would add in on the side of cknuck. I think there are huge flaws in what you are saying here woodswalker3. Your worst point was when you said that people are born homosexual then compared that to being a jew or black. The later to are both physical heritable traits and the former is a choice. Your way of proving your point was simply to say that we never made the choice to be hetersexual. Well, there is evidence both ways. People are born, naturally, wanting females. This involves a slew of hormones and visual stimuli that we are born with. These are the obvious biological facts. That is not to say that people can’t be born with scewed biological presets. I say scewed because if God made man to be joined with women, then a man with a man or women with women must be a mess up of the origional created people.
Basically, God made it one way and we see that people are doing it another. Either way, one way is sinful and one way is not. Plain and simple. That doesnt mean I go and commit sinfull acts (like violence). Unlike the koran and other religious materials, the bible prevents this violence you believe will occur. If a christian does violence to a homosexual, the christian community can rest assured that he is not backed by holy scripture.
A homosexual must admit his sin to God and fight with his unatural urges as best he can. That sounds terrible to someone who isn’t a christian or maybe simmply isnt following Gods law, but to a Christian who is saved and has, at times, experienced what it is like to live like God created us to, will know that the joy of prevailing in these battles can be amazing.
A drunk has to battle not to drink every night but in the end, the joy, standard of living, and spiritual revival he or she experiences will be amazing. Although, the Christian Road is not allways an easy road. It is often very difficult to live a true christian life. This issue is just another battle. The act of homosexuality is a sin. Accepting it in your life as an honest value is a sin. Having urges for the same sex is not a sin if you fight them and do not pursue them. Satan allways tries to temp us. Praise the Lord for his grace in our lives to not fall into the pits of life.



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nnmns

posted March 18, 2011 at 5:05 pm


GHUD you claim being a homosexual is a choice because it’s obvious to you it’s a choice. That doesn’t cut it. That’s not science and it’s not logic. It probably is your theology but that doesn’t recommend it.



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pagansister

posted March 18, 2011 at 8:38 pm


cknuck, you should be happy—GHUD thinks like you do—that is scary!



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Your Namestevemd2

posted March 18, 2011 at 8:47 pm


It always amamzes me how christian always need someone to condemn with their “sin” word, As if they have the right to judge.
christians who in previous times used the bible to justify slavery, the KKK hate groups, and segregation, etc etc.
Christians who hated catholics and vice versa.
Maybe its time to apply the bibles punishment to these “anything but” christians………..
death for wearing clothes made of different clothes, eating pig meat, sassing their parents, working on the sabbath.
Hell of a way to solve the overpopulation problem. In the end their churches will preach only to the dust in the pews and the dust of their departed.
And ameriKa and our gay friends will be free.
Reminds me of the old saying in France during the french revolution……….
Mankind will only be free when the last king is strangled with the guts of the last priest.



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jestrfyl

posted March 19, 2011 at 1:45 am


An odd day indeed when I find myself agreeing with Bob Schuller. But there you have it – and odd day indeed.



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cknuck

posted March 19, 2011 at 2:25 am


medically there is no way to trace homosexuality that is a fact no one wants to admit. Science can tell you if a person is a male or female, black, white, asian, native american, and on and on even years after death these determinations can be made. But there is no physical evidence of homosexuality, not bone structure, not genes, not hormores, not DNA which by the way can tell us everything about a person but not if the person is homosexual or not. So there is no evidence of how a person becomes homosexual which makes it completely unique to all other human scenario. I don’t think you can prove me wrong on this so I will applaud GHUD for their bold thinking and not falling to the unconfirmed position.



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Steve Hansen

posted March 19, 2011 at 4:46 am


I have heard that if all of the gays were to go on strike, most large churches would not be able to put on their Sunday morning show. Without musicians, singers, decorators, florists, and priests, the show cannot go on.
Seriously, the fact that being gay is not a choice, is very well established. Anyone with a lick of sense must realize that no one would choose to be discriminated and hated, as gay people are. God makes some people gay. We don’t know why.
The proper response from the churches would be to ask, “How should we minister to these people?” Once you ask that question, you have to realize that gay people are people, and that the church should minister to them.



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Steve Hansen

posted March 19, 2011 at 4:49 am


I have heard that if all of the gays were to go on strike, most large churches would not be able to put on their Sunday morning show. Without musicians, singers, decorators, florists, and priests, the show cannot go on.
Seriously, the fact that being gay is not a choice, is very well established. Anyone with a lick of sense must realize that no one would choose to be discriminated and hated, as gay people are. God makes some people gay. We don’t know why.
The proper response from the churches would be to ask, “How should we minister to these people?” Once you ask that question, you have to realize that gay people are people, and that the church should minister to them.



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Steve Hansen

posted March 19, 2011 at 4:55 am


The fact that being gay is not a choice, is very well established in the scientific literature. Anyone with a lick of common sense should realize that no one would choose to receive intense hate and discrimination, as gay people do. God makes some people gay. We don’t know why.
The question that the Church must answer is, “How should we minister to these people?” You must recognize that gay people are people. And, as people, the Church should minister to them.
Jesus never condemned anyone. The only people he ever criticized were the priests, for the sin of hypocrisy.



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feetxxxl

posted March 19, 2011 at 9:58 am


choice nor no choice is a rabbit trail that leads to nothing. what is important is the spirit that is in the lives of those who are being gay, which is that they live the fullness of christ’s love in their lives and marriages in the same way as do heterosexuals.
its the same about procreation. what is more important is that they provide loving nurturing homes for raising children in the same way as heterosexuals do, which is evidenced by their opening their homes for foster care or adoption for abandoned and rejected children from heterosexual unions.
that christendom would say that homosexuality was in any way a sin or was ln any way less than heterosexuality shows that christendom after 2000 years is still struggling to fully embrace the new covenant of christ.
when will we believers finally take our other foot out of the old covenant and finally in fully embracing the principles of the new covenant put it along side the other foot in the new.



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feetxxxl

posted March 19, 2011 at 10:00 am


choice nor no choice is a rabbit trail that leads to nothing. what is important is the spirit that is in the lives of those who are being gay, which is that they live the fullness of christ’s love in their lives and marriages in the same way as do heterosexuals.
its the same about procreation. what is more important is that they provide loving nurturing homes for raising children in the same way as heterosexuals do, which is evidenced by their opening their homes for foster care or adoption for abandoned and rejected children from heterosexual unions.
that christendom would say that homosexuality was in any way a sin or was ln any way less than heterosexuality shows that christendom after 2000 years is still struggling to fully embrace the new covenant of christ.
when will we believers finally take our other foot out of the old covenant and finally in embracing the principles of the new covenant put it along side the other foot in the new.



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feetxxxl

posted March 19, 2011 at 6:01 pm


it is so amazing that heterosexuals have such a high disregard for homosexuals as human beings that they will not trust the sincerity of heart of those who are gay who are their friends, relatives, coworkers, fellow believers, fellow citizens, neighbors,etc about what it is to be gay.



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cknuck

posted March 19, 2011 at 7:21 pm


steve your statement about homosexuality not being a choice because who would choose it is baseless there are lots of things humans do that makes not sense that people would do.
feetxxl Christ has made no new sodomy covenant one cannot live in the fullness of Christ while sodomizing men.



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cknuck

posted March 19, 2011 at 7:31 pm


wood you can’t substitute homosexuality for blacks or jews as you suggest one is a preference and the others are races and cultures they can hardly be compared that is a mistaken projection. One can’t be frighten of saying something is wrong because of the logic you present people that harm other people are wrong also. Just because I might say that homosexuality is wrong does not mean I have not addressed harming others is a horrible act. More people are harmed for other reasons and this is the state of humanity not nearly as many homosexuals are harmed as the poor people and people who harm others don’t really need reasons to do so.



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Mordred08

posted March 19, 2011 at 10:41 pm


GHUD, it’s very easy to tell people that they have to live with a burden you yourself don’t face. What kind of god would make people biologically inclined towards evil in such a way that for centuries his loyal followers felt it necessary to imprison and even murder them? That’s a pretty evil god, who should be rebelled against, not worshiped.



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cknuck

posted March 19, 2011 at 10:47 pm


mordred God had nothing to do with creating homosexuality He created man and He created woman as a matter of fact woman was the crown of His creations and His final creation everything else man created including homosexuality -(sin)



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Christian

posted March 20, 2011 at 10:09 am


Jesus Christ saved my soul and those of all who believe in Him and The Word. Robert Harold Schuller, saved my earthly life. Bad things happen to good people and I, a superior-rated soloist at age 10 in a Lutheran school, became the victim of pure evil in a public school in a different town just 50 miles away. That unmentionable horror would change my life for the worse for years and years ahead. But at age 12, my grandmother introduced me to a television church and explained it was related to the church of her family and Dutch ancestors. But still haunted by what was done to me, I first attempted suicide by hanging at 14. I did poorly in school, became introverted and ultimately drank and smoked pot to self-medicate the pain. After I left a beautiful and loving home with great parents who could not figure me out and whom I could never tell about the sinful things involving me, I went to California. I stayed with some friends, tried to find work but when I did I couldn’t keep it. I turned to Polk Street in San Francisco and proceeded to giving myself up. I want to say here, that it is my belief that there is a difference between those who prey on the innocent and those who live within homosexuality. There were “gay” people who were kind to me for kindness sake and no expectations of me. There were many more however, that just used me and that led to me and a friend going to Orange County.
I got a job, but still was homeless. I managed to stay clean and presentable, but at one point I became suicidal again, because it was so hard to work all day and go to a suitcase in the bushes to find a restroom to clean up. Suicidal again, I called NEW HOPE. A counselor there listened, prayed for me and then told me if I could stay away from the place where I had a room for a bit, she would go and pay for a week for me so I could get ahead. I followed her instructions, she did what she said and I was finally able to get a foothold towards an apartment and regular life. To this day, I do not know her name.
I eventually would go to the Cathedral campus and listen to organ practice or a bit further away if there was a wedding. I was raised “properly” and was not comfortable in blue jeans and a T-shirt at church. One day I was by the statue that has my confirmation passage on it, “The Lord is my Shepherd, I shall not want.” I love the artwork, but more the passage as it felt as though that was the only tie I had to God, especially “just as I was.” But some people came by and talked to me, then invited me to church. I told them, “Thank you – but I don’t have a suit and tie.” They laughed, which at first I was perplexed by but then explained, that was not a requirement at THIS church. So I went (at least finding a nice golf shirt and wearing my best blues) and was met by a couple of these friends and it only gets better from there.
This was almost 30 years ago. But I began watching that church and pastor 40 years ago at age 12. I am 52 today, married, working, closer to God than ever and prayerful for the church family that I love – but I am still a Lutheran :)
Son and grandson need to return to the father and grandfather. While a suit is not a requirement, the robe serves a purpose. It separates the man as himself, to being a called and ordained SERVANT (NOT a pious, pompous preacher!) The prodigals need to return, not to “the building” but the ministry. They all have unique gifts to give to it as do the daughters mentioned in this article. It’s not easy “filling the shoes” of the likes of RHS – but then – nobody expected that did they? Putting on the robe doesn’t make one a copy, or any holier than any sinner. It just masks the sinner within and of course if “Anthony” or “Vernon” want to preach with their shirt tails out, we won’t know about it!
This covenant – look – Robert H. rings true in the OCRegister statement. You cannot imagine how many “Gay Christians” (whom I have suggested to put their faith BEFORE their human sexuality) have come back to Christ because of one person – me – telling them that GOD LOVED THEM and they would find it at “my church”.
Look, God’s Word IS His Word. But you can’t go around saying “Thus sayeth the Lord…” when many don’t even know the Lord or His word which is not mean to imprison- but guide us. Robert H. Schuller knows that and unlike Joel Osteen and Charles Stanley among many other televangelists, The Hour of Power finishes each program by panning to and zooming in on: THE CROSS
That symbol is for all people of any color, creed, nationality, sexuality, etc. – it’s up to THE INDIVIDUAL to come to Christ, and THAT truly is FREEDOM!.
God bless you Pastor Robert Harold Schuller. I am praying for you, your family and the beautiful church you and all of us built to the Glory of Almighty God.
Chris



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Christian

posted March 20, 2011 at 10:10 am


Jesus Christ saved my soul and those of all who believe in Him and The Word. Robert Harold Schuller, saved my earthly life. Bad things happen to good people and I, a superior-rated soloist at age 10 in a Lutheran school, became the victim of pure evil in a public school in a different town just 50 miles away. That unmentionable horror would change my life for the worse for years and years ahead. But at age 12, my grandmother introduced me to a television church and explained it was related to the church of her family and Dutch ancestors. But still haunted by what was done to me, I first attempted suicide by hanging at 14. I did poorly in school, became introverted and ultimately drank and smoked pot to self-medicate the pain. After I left a beautiful and loving home with great parents who could not figure me out and whom I could never tell about the sinful things involving me, I went to California. I stayed with some friends, tried to find work but when I did I couldn’t keep it. I turned to Polk Street in San Francisco and proceeded to giving myself up. I want to say here, that it is my belief that there is a difference between those who prey on the innocent and those who live within homosexuality. There were “gay” people who were kind to me for kindness sake and no expectations of me. There were many more however, that just used me and that led to me and a friend going to Orange County.
I got a job, but still was homeless. I managed to stay clean and presentable, but at one point I became suicidal again, because it was so hard to work all day and go to a suitcase in the bushes to find a restroom to clean up. Suicidal again, I called NEW HOPE. A counselor there listened, prayed for me and then told me if I could stay away from the place where I had a room for a bit, she would go and pay for a week for me so I could get ahead. I followed her instructions, she did what she said and I was finally able to get a foothold towards an apartment and regular life. To this day, I do not know her name.
I eventually would go to the Cathedral campus and listen to organ practice or a bit further away if there was a wedding. I was raised “properly” and was not comfortable in blue jeans and a T-shirt at church. One day I was by the statue that has my confirmation passage on it, “The Lord is my Shepherd, I shall not want.” I love the artwork, but more the passage as it felt as though that was the only tie I had to God, especially “just as I was.” But some people came by and talked to me, then invited me to church. I told them, “Thank you – but I don’t have a suit and tie.” They laughed, which at first I was perplexed by but then explained, that was not a requirement at THIS church. So I went (at least finding a nice golf shirt and wearing my best blues) and was met by a couple of these friends and it only gets better from there.
This was almost 30 years ago. But I began watching that church and pastor 40 years ago at age 12. I am 52 today, married, working, closer to God than ever and prayerful for the church family that I love – but I am still a Lutheran :)
Son and grandson need to return to the father and grandfather. While a suit is not a requirement, the robe serves a purpose. It separates the man as himself, to being a called and ordained SERVANT (NOT a pious, pompous preacher!) The prodigals need to return, not to “the building” but the ministry. They all have unique gifts to give to it as do the daughters mentioned in this article. It’s not easy “filling the shoes” of the likes of RHS – but then – nobody expected that did they? Putting on the robe doesn’t make one a copy, or any holier than any sinner. It just masks the sinner within and of course if “Anthony” or “Vernon” want to preach with their shirt tails out, we won’t know about it!
This covenant – look – Robert H. rings true in the OCRegister statement. You cannot imagine how many “Gay Christians” (whom I have suggested to put their faith BEFORE their human sexuality) have come back to Christ because of one person – me – telling them that GOD LOVED THEM and they would find it at “my church”.
Look, God’s Word IS His Word. But you can’t go around saying “Thus sayeth the Lord…” when many don’t even know the Lord or His word which is not mean to imprison- but guide us. Robert H. Schuller knows that and unlike Joel Osteen and Charles Stanley among many other televangelists, The Hour of Power finishes each program by panning to and zooming in on: THE CROSS
That symbol is for all people of any color, creed, nationality, sexuality, etc. – it’s up to THE INDIVIDUAL to come to Christ, and THAT truly is FREEDOM!.
God bless you Pastor Robert Harold Schuller. I am praying for you, your family and the beautiful church you and all of us built to the Glory of Almighty God.
Chris



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Christian

posted March 20, 2011 at 10:12 am


Jesus Christ saved my soul and those of all who believe in Him and The Word. Robert Harold Schuller, saved my earthly life. Bad things happen to good people and I, a superior-rated soloist at age 10 in a Lutheran school, became the victim of pure evil in a public school in a different town just 50 miles away. That unmentionable horror would change my life for the worse for years and years ahead. But at age 12, my grandmother introduced me to a television church and explained it was related to the church of her family and Dutch ancestors. But still haunted by what was done to me, I first attempted suicide by hanging at 14. I did poorly in school, became introverted and ultimately drank and smoked pot to self-medicate the pain. After I left a beautiful and loving home with great parents who could not figure me out and whom I could never tell about the sinful things involving me, I went to California. I stayed with some friends, tried to find work but when I did I couldn’t keep it. I turned to Polk Street in San Francisco and proceeded to giving myself up. I want to say here, that it is my belief that there is a difference between those who prey on the innocent and those who live within homosexuality. There were “gay” people who were kind to me for kindness sake and no expectations of me. There were many more however, that just used me and that led to me and a friend going to Orange County.
I got a job, but still was homeless. I managed to stay clean and presentable, but at one point I became suicidal again, because it was so hard to work all day and go to a suitcase in the bushes to find a restroom to clean up. Suicidal again, I called NEW HOPE. A counselor there listened, prayed for me and then told me if I could stay away from the place where I had a room for a bit, she would go and pay for a week for me so I could get ahead. I followed her instructions, she did what she said and I was finally able to get a foothold towards an apartment and regular life. To this day, I do not know her name.
I eventually would go to the Cathedral campus and listen to organ practice or a bit further away if there was a wedding. I was raised “properly” and was not comfortable in blue jeans and a T-shirt at church. One day I was by the statue that has my confirmation passage on it, “The Lord is my Shepherd, I shall not want.” I love the artwork, but more the passage as it felt as though that was the only tie I had to God, especially “just as I was.” But some people came by and talked to me, then invited me to church. I told them, “Thank you – but I don’t have a suit and tie.” They laughed, which at first I was perplexed by but then explained, that was not a requirement at THIS church. So I went (at least finding a nice golf shirt and wearing my best blues) and was met by a couple of these friends and it only gets better from there.
This was almost 30 years ago. But I began watching that church and pastor 40 years ago at age 12. I am 52 today, married, working, closer to God than ever and prayerful for the church family that I love – but I am still a Lutheran :)
Son and grandson need to return to the father and grandfather. While a suit is not a requirement, the robe serves a purpose. It separates the man as himself, to being a called and ordained SERVANT (NOT a pious, pompous preacher!) The prodigals need to return, not to “the building” but the ministry. They all have unique gifts to give to it as do the daughters mentioned in this article. It’s not easy “filling the shoes” of the likes of RHS – but then – nobody expected that did they? Putting on the robe doesn’t make one a copy, or any holier than any sinner. It just masks the sinner within and of course if “Anthony” or “Vernon” want to preach with their shirt tails out, we won’t know about it!
This covenant – look – Robert H. rings true in the OCRegister statement. You cannot imagine how many “Gay Christians” (whom I have suggested to put their faith BEFORE their human sexuality) have come back to Christ because of one person – me – telling them that GOD LOVED THEM and they would find it at “my church”.
Look, God’s Word IS His Word. But you can’t go around saying “Thus sayeth the Lord…” when many don’t even know the Lord or His word which is not mean to imprison- but guide us. Robert H. Schuller knows that and unlike Joel Osteen and Charles Stanley among many other televangelists, The Hour of Power finishes each program by panning to and zooming in on: THE CROSS
That symbol is for all people of any color, creed, nationality, sexuality, etc. – it’s up to THE INDIVIDUAL to come to Christ, and THAT truly is FREEDOM!.
God bless you Pastor Robert Harold Schuller. I am praying for you, your family and the beautiful church you and all of us built to the Glory of Almighty God.
Chris



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Christian

posted March 20, 2011 at 10:15 am


Dr. Schuller rings true to himself. The Cathedral has alway been open for all people to worship Almighty God and come to Christ. He is not to be blamed for uncompromising The Word!
That said, I have never known the Cathedral to turn away anybody because of homosexuality.
I think Sheila needs to remember Virgil Fox playing for Hour of Power and a few other names I won’t mention here, because they are still with us on earth.



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Christian

posted March 20, 2011 at 10:19 am


clean and presentable, but at one point I became suicidal again, because it was so hard to work all day and go to a suitcase in the bushes to find a restroom to clean up. Suicidal again, I called NEW HOPE. A counselor there listened, prayed for me and then told me if I could stay away from the place where I had a room for a bit, she would go and pay for a week for me so I could get ahead. I followed her instructions, she did what she said and I was finally able to get a foothold towards an apartment and regular life. To this day, I do not know her name.
I eventually would go to the Cathedral campus and listen to organ practice or a bit further away if there was a wedding. I was raised “properly” and was not comfortable in blue jeans and a T-shirt at church. One day I was by the statue that has my confirmation passage on it, “The Lord is my Shepherd, I shall not want.” I love the artwork, but more the passage as it felt as though that was the only tie I had to God, especially “just as I was.” But some people came by and talked to me, then invited me to church. I told them, “Thank you – but I don’t have a suit and tie.” They laughed, which at first I was perplexed by but then explained, that was not a requirement at THIS church. So I went (at least finding a nice golf shirt and wearing my best blues) and was met by a couple of these friends and it only gets better from there.
This was almost 30 years ago. But I began watching that church and pastor 40 years ago at age 12. I am 52 today, married, working, closer to God than ever and prayerful for the church family that I love – but I am still a Lutheran :)
Son and grandson need to return to the father and grandfather. While a suit is not a requirement, the robe serves a purpose. It separates the man as himself, to being a called and ordained SERVANT (NOT a pious, pompous preacher!) The prodigals need to return, not to “the building” but the ministry. They all have unique gifts to give to it as do the daughters mentioned in this article. It’s not easy “filling the shoes” of the likes of RHS – but then – nobody expected that did they? Putting on the robe doesn’t make one a copy, or any holier than any sinner. It just masks the sinner within and of course if “Anthony” or “Vernon” want to preach with their shirt tails out, we won’t know about it!
This covenant – look – Robert H. rings true in the OCRegister statement. You cannot imagine how many “Gay Christians” (whom I have suggested to put their faith BEFORE their human sexuality) have come back to Christ because of one person – me – telling them that GOD LOVED THEM and they would find it at “my church”.
Look, God’s Word IS His Word. But you can’t go around saying “Thus sayeth the Lord…” when many don’t even know the Lord or His word which is not mean to imprison- but guide us. Robert H. Schuller knows that and unlike Joel Osteen and Charles Stanley among many other televangelists, The Hour of Power finishes each program by panning to and zooming in on: THE CROSS
That symbol is for all people of any color, creed, nationality, sexuality, etc. – it’s up to THE INDIVIDUAL to come to Christ, and THAT truly is FREEDOM!.
God bless you Pastor Robert Harold Schuller. I am praying for you, your family and the beautiful church you and all of us built to the Glory of Almighty God.



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Mordred08

posted March 20, 2011 at 1:25 pm


“mordred God had nothing to do with creating homosexuality He created man and He created woman as a matter of fact woman was the crown of His creations and His final creation everything else man created including homosexuality -(sin)”
cknuck, if your god didn’t create homosexuality, then explain Romans 1:26-27
“For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.”
God gave them up. Not Satan, not man, not the Democrats, not the public school system, not popular music of the 1960s. God did it. God made people gay, then punished them with death for…being gay. Don’t give me some crap about how I pulled that out of thin air. To paraphrase Rachel Maddow, “That’s from your book, dude.”
P.S. : It’s been a while since I’ve been in a church, but I’m pretty sure there’s no biblical prohibition against using periods.



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Mordred08

posted March 20, 2011 at 2:00 pm


Beliefnet, fix your comment system. I made a comment on this article yesterday, and it didn’t show up til about an hour ago.



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cknuck

posted March 20, 2011 at 7:28 pm


yes mordred I am impressed that you are actually reading the bible but no where does it say God created homosexuality He just removed Himself from their affairs. Many say that when God does give us over to our own reprobate thinking we are capable of anything (homosexuality included) but God do not have to create sin for us, we do a pretty good job on our own. Thank you for a civil exchange my friend even if we do disagree.



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