Mark D. Roberts

Mark D. Roberts


Why Not Just Leave the PC(USA)? Part 3

posted by Mark D. Roberts

Part 3 of series: Why Not Just Leave the PC(USA)?
Permalink for this post / Permalink for this series
So far I’ve offered three answers to the question: Why don’t you just leave the PC(USA)? They are:

1. I’m not leaving the PC(USA) because my church is part of the PC(USA).
2. I’m not leaving the PC(USA) because I have dear friends and partners in ministry in this denomination.
3. I’m not leaving the PC(USA) because, as of this moment, I have not been required by the denomination to do something that is contrary to my conscience.

Here’s another reason:
4. I’m not leaving the PC(USA) because there is no perfect denomination or church.
The PC(USA) has problems, plenty of them. But it’s not as if other denominations and churches are hassle-free. The Southern Baptists aren’t exactly having a happy church picnic. Neither are the Episcopalians. Nor the Methodists. In fact, every denomination of which I am aware has its share of problems. So if I were to switch from the PC(USA) to a denomination what was theologically and missionally more in line with my own convictions, before long I’d realize that the grass really wasn’t too much greener on the other side of the fence after all.
I have learned this lesson indirectly from several friends who have left the PC(USA). For example, about ten years ago, a friend I’ll call Greg decided that he’d had enough of the PC(USA)’s theological “all-over-the-mapness.” He wanted to be in a denomination that was theologically conservative and clear. So, though he as a PC(USA) pastor and had graduated from Princeton Seminary, a PC(USA) flagship, he determined to leave the denomination. Before long he was called to be the pastor of a PCA church. The Presbyterian Church in America is a conservative denomination, which, in 1973, broke off from the denomination that became the PC(USA) over issues of biblical authority, theological clarity, and the ordination of women. In the last few years, the PCA has been growing steadily, unlike the shrinking PC(USA), though it continues to be considerably smaller than the PC(USA). There are many outstanding PCA churches, notably Redeemer Presbyterian Church in New York City, where Tim Keller is the senior pastor.
Anyway, back to my story about Greg. He and I remained friends after he left the PC(USA), though we didn’t have much contact for a while. A couple of years after he had joined the PCA, Greg and I had lunch. I asked him how it was going in his new denomination, expecting to hear how much happier he was now than before. “I’ve got to be honest,” he said, “though I’m in much greater in agreement with the PCA theology, I’m getting tired of debates about whether the days in Genesis 1 are literal or not. Sometimes I wish I were back in the PC(USA), where I could be a conservative standing up for biblical truth, rather than someone whose conservative credentials are suspect. Plus, we have plenty of churches with lots of problems. I’m glad I’m pastoring the church I’m in, but sometimes I regret leaving the PC(USA), in spite of all of its issues.”
There isn’t a prefect denomination. Were I to switch to something else, I’d leave behind one set of problems but take on another set.
I expect that, at this point, some of my readers might want to shout: “Then why not join an independent, non-denominational church? You wouldn’t have denominational hassles to worry about.” Indeed. Sometimes non-denominationalism seems to offer much greener grass. I know of some fantastic non-denominational churches, like RockHarbor Church in Costa Mesa, California, near where I used to live. This is a dynamic, growing, theologically-solid church. I know several of the pastors there, and hold them in high regard. (Photo: Todd Proctor is the Lead Pastor [i.e. Senior Pastor] of RockHarbor. Curiously enough, he’s not the primary teacher/preacher. Todd is an accomplished worship leader and composer who has strong leadership gifts.)
But even RockHarbor has its problems. Moreover, I’ve watched lots of independent churches struggle mightily in ways denominational churches often avoid. Because they’re free to make it up as they go along, rather than follow denominational wisdom and be held accountable by denominational bodies, non-denominational churches sometimes get into huge messes. For example, I know of one megachurch in which the board of elders was unhappy with its Senior Pastor. So the board got together and fired the pastor, hiring a brand new pastor in the same meeting. When people arrived at the worship service on the next Sunday morning, they were informed that they had a brand new Senior Pastor. You can imagine the reaction from the people, most of whom had no idea there were problems with the former pastor. The lack of any sort of pastoral transition contributed to the ultimate demise of this once thriving church.
I’ve also had friends who have been summarily fired without due process by their independent churches. In one case, a pastor who thought he was doing a good job was terminated, given only two weeks notice and compensation. The fact that he was supporting a family of four children didn’t seem to matter to the board. This man had no recourse other than to sue his church, which he refused to do on biblical grounds. So he and his family entered an extended season of grief, anger, and financial hardship.
Now I expect some of my readers are wondering why we should bother with the church at all. I can understand such wondering. Sometimes I’ve thought the same myself. But I believe that the church is, in addition to being a human institution with plenty of problems, the body of Christ and the dwelling place of the Holy Spirit. Yes, the church in general and churches in particular have lots of problems. That’s the way it is this side of the new creation. But churches also do lots and lots and lots of good, often representing Christ quite faithfully. Moreover, there are strong theological reasons to be committed to the church, and even to hang with a denomination in crisis. I’ll touch upon some of these reasons in my next post.



  • http://www.mod.reyes-chow.com Bruce Reyes-Chow

    Thanks again. I remember many years back some of us “young whipper snappers” were sitting around complaining about the PC(USA) and saying that we should just go start something ourselves. One of our mentors kindly, but firmly, said to us, “There is no there there.” reminded us of exactly what you are saying. Certainly there could be a better place, but perfection is saved for Christ. If folks care why the moderator is staying, here is one that I wrote last year:
    http://www.reyes-chow.com/2007/05/top_10_reasons_.html
    Thanks again – Bruce

  • Paul Johnston

    I’m following your most recent series with some interest, and will probably have more to comment later when I have more time. But I found the concept of “tolerable stupidities” which I learned from Richard Lovelace (who got it from Calvin, I believe) to be very helpful. Nothing’s perfect, and some imperfections can be very annoying and troubling without being fatal. On the other hand, some imperfections are fatal — “intolerable stupidities” might be a good word. Recognizing which is which is probably the key to discerning the question of leaving.

  • Jim L

    Paul J. is exactly right. It is all about the essentials and how the denomination is run. What are the differences within the denomination? Are they over essentials or other less important issues? What spiritual dangers exist by staying within the current denomination or moving to a different denomination? Are the disagreements sapping the church and pastors and keeping them from (or hindering) their mission?

  • Dave Moody

    Gotta agree with Paul J. and Jim L, and Calvin on this one. Having the wisdom to differentiate between deadly and merely stupid, and then if it is deadly- if it is temporary or terminal., seems to be what is called for.
    Over at Classical Presbyterian, one of the commenters brought up Luther’s line, likening the church to Noah’s Ark- if it weren’t for the storm outside, you couldn’t stand the stink inside.
    I think there’s a reason St. John says, “Maranantha, Lord Jesus! Come Quickly!”
    Thanks Mark, as always for your trenchant analysis…

  • J.Falconer

    Rev. Roberts, Thank you for another excellent post in your series. I like to think & occasionally say Who’s perfect but God? Hopefully , most Christians eventually want to go to the right place-upstairs. Modern day issues & theology lend themselves to constant debate, individual opinions, interpretation, & controversy. Thank God for the Living Bible translation & the Holy Spirit’s Guidance. I imagine the days & times we’re all in will stay very interesting, & hopefully not too confusing! God Bless & Give Our Best to Your Family, Church Family in Boerne & Laity Lodge

  • http://www.markdroberts.com Mark Roberts

    Thanks, friends, for these helpful comments. I love the notion of “tolerable stupidities.” I think I’m going to tell my wife about this phrase.

  • http://markdroberts.com/?p=565 Why Not Just Leave the PC(USA)? Part 4 | www.markdroberts.com

Previous Posts

More blogs to enjoy!!!
Thank you for visiting Mark D. Roberts. This blog is no longer being updated. Please enjoy the archives. Here are some other blogs you may also enjoy: Red Letters with Tom Davis Recent prayer post on Prayables Most Recent Inspiration blog post Happy Reading!  

posted 2:09:11pm Aug. 27, 2012 | read full post »

Why Did Jesus Have to Die? Conclusions
In this series on the death of Jesus, I have presented four different perspectives on why Jesus had to die: Roman, Jewish, Jesus’, and Early Christian. I believe that each of these points of view has merit, and that we cannot fully understand the necessity of Jesus’ death without taking them all

posted 2:47:39am Apr. 11, 2011 | read full post »

Sunday Inspiration from the High Calling
Can We Find God in the City? Psalm 48:1-14 Go, inspect the city of Jerusalem. Walk around and count the many towers. Take note of the fortified walls, and tour all the citadels, that you may describe them to future generations. For that is what God is like. He is our God forever and ever,

posted 2:05:51am Apr. 10, 2011 | read full post »

Why Did Jesus Have to Die? The Perspective of the First Christians, Part 3
An Act and Symbol of Love Perhaps one of the most startling of the early Christian interpretations of the cross was that it was all about love. It’s easy in our day, when crosses are religious symbols, attractive ornaments, and trendy jewelry to associate the cross with love. But, in the first

posted 2:41:47am Apr. 08, 2011 | read full post »

Why Did Jesus Have to Die? The Perspective of the First Christians, Part 2
The Means of Reconciliation In my last post, I examined one of the very earliest Christian statements of the purpose of Jesus’ death. According to the tradition encapsulated in 1 Corinthians 15, Jesus died “for our sins in accordance with the scriptures” (15:3). Yet this text doesn’t expl

posted 2:30:03am Apr. 07, 2011 | read full post »




Report as Inappropriate

You are reporting this content because it violates the Terms of Service.

All reported content is logged for investigation.