J Walking

J Walking


The faith-based voter

posted by David Kuo

Thank you Holly for finding this one. It sort of speaks for itself.
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Donny

posted September 29, 2007 at 7:40 am


Big difference between the GOP and the Democrats. The Democrats keep reelecting, promoting and celebrating their miscreants; while the Republicans rid their party of them when they are exposed. Take another look at the cartoon. If those names were Democrats they would all still be in place.
Might want to look up in the Bible who and what is worse. People that sin, or those that encourage, promote and celebrate sin and sin to others.
That is why voting for a Democrat is not what a Christian should do.



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Thinker

posted September 29, 2007 at 8:39 am


Donny, how come there are so many Christians who feel the opposite? We find Scripture would direct us in an opposite manner – that our hearts and prayer direct us in an entirely different fashion. You would say we are wrong. The conscience part – the educated and developed conscience – goes with me. I cannot vote for anyone who campaigns as if we were still putting a “ban” on the middle east. I cannot vote for anyone who still believes that a free market economy – one that ignores the widows and orphans of our day – is an entirely moral way of being. Can’t vote for those who believe some human beings – the women half – should not be able to control what happens to them in the world. Can’t believe in those who gather mobs around the “aliens” of our time offering neither hospitality nor justice. Just can’t do it. Can’t vote for anyone who has not thought through the terrible consequences that refuse care to some – usually the most vulnerable. (I mean – let’s see- should we just put big dumpsters outside of hospitals so we can directly get rid of those who are illegal or poor or addicted. Would that be a solution to that issue.
And war – yes, in the old Testament it was the way of things – an early and primitive solution to conflict. Now we call people Islama-fascists – put an inhuman face on them and keep it firmly in mind – and we can deal with the ineptitude of war, the terror and fear and illogic of war. All you have to do is keep your victims blank faces – blood on the streets – and you can just pretend that we have a right to be there and that they have no right to defend theselves. Our soldiers – our young men and women who are all about serving – we would pray for healing for them – it will take a lifetime to heal them of their actions, the acts against them, their visions of blood and killing. Can’t vote for more war, more violence, more paranoia. But then there are those terribly important issues – gay marriage being one that are distractions. When we get all upset about who broke the Sabbath and who loves who – well, guess we’re falling into that scribe and pharisee camp.
You are a good man, a prayerful man, but please stop demonizing those who are equally good and prayerful and who disagree with you profoundly. Republicans get rid of sinners – well – good luck – because they’re all sinners as are all Democrats and all Independents. You’ve decided you know what they are – you don’t.



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Donny

posted September 29, 2007 at 8:01 pm


Thinker,
Democrat politics is so antithetical to Christian culture, I cannot see why and how you would defend it.
What people do can define “what” they are. I decided that after a long time of seeing our society getting more and more perverted. Remember the justice system? If you commit a burglary you are called a burglar. Unless of course some Lib-Psychologist gets to court before the DA does.
Free market ecomony is real freedom. Once a young person sees the money leave their own paycheck they start understanding why the GOP is such a good political party.
So socialism is the answer? It has turned Europe into a cesspool of porn and vice. Russia ring a bell? Amsterdam anyone? The poor and the needy are prostitutes or worse. “Who your daddy?” Poor children do not know. Their “daddy” lives a liberal lifestyle of anything goes. Sorry Thinker, no where in the Gospels or in anything written by the Apostles does “anything” go. Especially same-gender marriage. It just doesn’t exist in Christian culture. Leave Paul out of it, and show me where Peter, John, James or Jude support Liberal theology on anything? You’ll have to read a Bible published by Sojouners or Soulforce for that nonsense.
No one should be able to kill anyone. I am against the death penalty for anyone. Rotting in jail for a lifetime seems so much more like it to me. I left the military voluntarily and have “two” honorable discharges. One for my length of service and the other for “re” enlisting for Desert Shield. I do not agree with American soldiers dying for Muslims.
I view the Christian through the lens of the Apostles writings. Jesus put a lot of stock in them and so do I. You cannot justify secular socialism, and you cannot justify “Liberal and Progressive” theology by using the Gospels or the Writings of the Apostles. That is why Liberals and Progresives have to alter them.
Same-gender sex acts should be an incredibly big deal as it cements the corruption of our society. Notice that it is NOT tolerance that the LGBTers seek, it is to indoctrinate our children. It is not about their rights, it is about forcing their sexual proclivities on all. Notice that our youth is supportive of gay marriage. They no longer can see right from wrong. Your fellow Democrats in Hollywood have seen to that. You NEVER hear of any morality from the homosexual community except wear a condom. Ever been to the big city Thinker? Or now, any cite ot town? Homosexuality is now quite common. Far past even the ten-percent gay numbers.
Christians should have nothing to do with homosexuals and the promotion of it at all. If the Democrats want to legalize gay marriage and sodomy, and outlaw Christians for teaching what Christ Jesus and the Apostles taught, so be it. We’ve survived these kinds of people before and we will again.
“I” do not judge anyone. “I” agree with the Christ Jesus and the Apostles with how they created our Christian culture and community. “I” didn’t invent what we call “Christianity” today, and it is certainly well within my rights to point out those that contradict the New Testament record. Liberals and Progressives violate scripture and cal it a right.
The Apostles died to bring us their words. They were killed by people so eerily similar to todays Liberals and Progressives – the power of the Democrat Party – that they can be quite honestly be called one and the same. I urge you to study the history of the Church and the secular world in which it developed.
I noticed that you will not present any scripture to support Liberal/Progressive politics or social views. Other than non-violence, which they are unbelieveably hypocritical on, they have no support for anything they want to inflict on society. They have Marx, Nietzche and Dewey, but no one from the Biblical record supporting them.
I am a registered Independent. I am a Christian, and I am just a man. But I have both eyes open and both ears listening. I know right from wrong. Now.



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Doug

posted September 29, 2007 at 9:24 pm


Brother Donny, an observation: I think I’ve noticed that you are a moral relativist when you talk about Republicans and an absolutist when you talk about Democrats. We get “At least the Republicans…” or “Bush might not be perfect, but” along with, essentially “all Democrats promote sodomy.” And not to pile on, but regarding the Republicans being like the apostles and the scripture you present to support the view, I can only say “thou hast said it.” A lot of people find the right wing to be more like the Sanhedrin than the apostles.
I’m kind of in the middle (neither hot nor cold) on the parties but it reminds me of a sermon I once heard about Lazarus and Dives. The pastor pointed out that most people read that strory with a sense that Dives represents people richer than them getting their comeuppance. And some people see themselves in Lazarus, poor and persecuted but holy. But, the pastor pointed out, we are not Lazarus and our neighbors aren’t the rich man. Those two are dead in the story. We are the Rich man’s brothers who need the news. So it is with the Sanhedrin and the Apostles and all the good and bad people in the bible. They are dead and have found their reward. James Dobson, John Kerry, Hillary Clinton, Mike Huckabee, Elton John and you and I and David and Thinker aren’t like any of them. We are alive and in need of the Gospel.



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Donny

posted September 30, 2007 at 8:27 am


First, good morning. It’s great that on this blog people will challenge me. Genesis 18:20 And the LORD said, ” The outcry of Sodom and Gomorrah is indeed great, and their sin is exceedingly grave.” Who’s crying out to the Lord? It certainly is not the people that threaten those that hamper the indulgences and behaviors in the crowd of men of Sodom. The crowd made that clear. And, it is all about hospitality, and forcing others to promote, encourage and condone is most inhospitable.
Look it is very simple this “Christian in politics thing.” Look at what is happening TO children and teens. GOP politics values “the family” for real. The Democrats literally promote what is clearly abominations to the Christian Culture and Community known as “The Church.” Nothing “relativist” in that. The writings of the Apostles prove that. If we are to cast away the New Testament simply because the people mentioned in it are “dead,” then Christianity and The Church are meaningless and relativistic. That is your logic not mine. If we are truly the Rich man’s brothers, then we should surely not become Democrats/Liberals/Progressives, because hedonism drives their lives. “Do as thou wilt . . .” gets people into hell. And I make that charge against Liberals, Progressives and Democrats every chance I get, hoping someone will do the research and see that for themselves also. The New Testament writers testify against your assertion though. Democrat politics is extremely hostile towards Christians. I believe that lovey-dovey Christians fool themselves and have been fooled by Democrats crying for peace and using Christians for their agenda.
Jesus and the Apostles clearly indicate they are speaking to individuals and to the future Church body. Altering and changing the New Testament writings for political and corrupt social change is what a relativist does. Obviously I am not a relativist. Please put that mantle on a Liberal/Progressive. It is proveable. I repent and do not want to revisit my sins and sin life. A very compatible choise when reading what the Lord said and the Apostles wrote on behalf of The Church.
Without doubt we have seen perverts in the GOP doing gay, pederast, adulterous, larcenous and even murderous things, but when exposed they are not excused or just laughed off or continually reelected like a Democrat is.
I have to choose from only one of two political parties or my vote is wasted. I have to use scripture, which I agree with Paul on, is to be used for correcting, reproof etc., etc., you know, for the Christian to discern what is truth with.
I do not see Christian truth in socialism, taxing the family so they’ll never be able to own “a home,” giving the poor excuses for living poor, supporting, encouraging and promoting unwed mothers (look up Murphy Brown versus Dan Quayle), holding up role modles for youth who are adulterers, womanizers, and the list of other sexual deviances Democrats promote.
So let’s look at your statement in light of scripture:
“. So it is with the Sanhedrin and the Apostles and all the good and bad people in the bible. They are dead and have found their reward. James Dobson, John Kerry, Hillary Clinton, Mike Huckabee, Elton John and you and I and David and Thinker aren’t like any of them. We are alive and in need of the Gospel.”
Umm, according to the writings of the New Testament, some are “alive IN Christ,” and some are not, but all are certainly “aware” of where they “are.” I see people in your list that are Christians and I see some that either mock the Church, or are “arguably” opposed to what Jesus said and taught (preached) what the Apostles wrote on and taught (preached). Hard to call them “Christians” too isn’t it? The relativist’s are once again in the opposite camp from that of Christ Jesus and the Apostles and always in the Liberal/Progresive and Democrat group. Certainly NOT members of the Church. “Yet.” Remember there is always hope this side of death. And also, the GOP does not see the word “repent” as hate crime speech. Many in the Democrat party do.
Jesus taught us “how” to choose right from wrong in the Gospels. The Apostles elaborated on that in every letter they wrote.
“Study” and see for yourself.



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aquaman

posted October 1, 2007 at 11:22 am


“Forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trespass against us.”
Two different concepts– being forgiven, and forgiving others. Why are they linked in the Lord’s Prayer? Is it because we wish to boast to God about how forgiving we are of our sisters and brothers? Surely not. Is it because God’s grace (forgiveness) is conditioned upon our own action (forgiving others)? That’s what I learned as a child, and it’s not without support in Scripture, but I now believe that view gives short shrift to grace.
I have come to believe that TRULY accepting God’s forgiveness profoundly humbles us. Then, being so humbled, we forgive others– not because it is empowering to forgive (though it can be), but because forgiving becomes the natural thing for us to do.
Martin Luther put it more simply in his 95 theses: “the whole life of believers should be repentance … God remits guilt to no one whom He does not, at the same time, humble in all things.”
Perhaps we could all be more humble. (I know I could be!) And perhaps, in our gratitude for being forgiven, we could extend the benefit of the doubt to those who disagree with us.
Peace.



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Doug

posted October 1, 2007 at 1:28 pm


OK, Donny, and I very much enjoy challenging back and forth and I appreciate your answer but let me try back. Maybe you can see what I mean:
1. You have proven the apostles are good and worthy, but not that there is a modern analog to either the apostles nor their enemies. You assert that regularly, but I don’t think you’ve proven it. You don’t have to prove anything to vote however you want to vote, but claimed analogies only persuade people who want to be persuaded. In other words, I think you successfully defend your positions but there’s a lot of wiggle room for the rest of us to disagree with them.
2. I think there is a basic unfairness in the fact that you forgive the Republicans so much and yet allow for no virtuous Democrats. I see your point, that you have to choose a party to vote for so you go with the one that’s closest to your rhetoric, but if you’re going to be that understanding with the people you vote for in spite of transgressions (Sen. Vitter hasn’t been asked to step down as far as I know, by the way) but then is it honest to lump pro-life Democrats together with pro-choice Democrats and all the sexually average Democrats in with pedophiles? I could be wrong but I don’t see an elected Democrat who gets caught engaging in sex with a child keeping their job, either.



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