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What do you consider more athletic?

posted by xscot mcknight

A 350 pound fat man wrestling with another 350 pound fat man so that the latter can manhandle a 215 pound quarterback standing still, or a sleek 200 pound man on the edge of life trying to hit a 95 mph fastball into the creases of a green velvet outfield and, when he does succeed, watching that ball slip into the corners of a ball park while time stands still and 40,000 fans go silent in anticipation of just how far the runner will get?
Is it worth answering? Priceless.



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Tyler Williams

posted September 16, 2005 at 11:08 pm


Neither, IMHO. The more athletic is the rugby forward who runs, tackles, mauls, and scrums for 80 minutes straight! (Sorry, couldn’t resist. As a Canadian I never really got into watching Baseball and American football is too slow paced!)



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Royal Farris

posted September 16, 2005 at 11:17 pm


Have you ever tried being a 350 lb man who runs a 5 second 40 yrd dash wrestling another 350 lb man who is just as fast an can bench press a car? Or being a 215 lb QB running from four 350 lb men who are as fast or faster than you while threading a football through the eye of a needle into the arms of a man running down the field at 4.2 seconds per 40 while being chased and hit by two other men just as fast who do not want you to catch the ball.
All it takes is swinging the bat many times to be able to hit a 95 mph fast ball. And the best only seem to manage to hit it about three out of ten time. Anyone can hit a ball three out of ten times if they have the time to practice and the passion to hit the ball. Not many do….Have the passion or the patience.
There are not that many huge men with the athletic abilities of football players.
Football makes waiting on a ball to be hit over a fence very dull indeed. Yawn….I will go with you if you give me a ticket cause you can get a lot of talking in between hits, but I would not pay for it.



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Fr'nklin

posted September 16, 2005 at 11:35 pm


I wish I could like baseball…but it is the most boring thing…besides NASCAR…I’ve ever tried to watch. I LOVE football and Basketball (Go DUKE!), but baseball and NASCAR, well, I’ll take them on a Sunday p.m. when I can sleep! Maybe someday I’ll learn how to appreciate them…until then…



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Jamie Arpin-Ricci

posted September 17, 2005 at 1:48 am


After marrying an Aussie, I have to give my vote to rugby as well. Those blokes are fit, fierce and… something else that would fit here that would complete this alliteration but which I can’t think of. Oh well…
Peace,
Jamie



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Lukas McKnight

posted September 17, 2005 at 8:10 am


There are fewer people that can hit a 95 mph fastball than those that can be 350 lbs.



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Kris

posted September 17, 2005 at 8:18 am


Excuse me, but baseball is ANYTHING but boring. There is so much strategy – it is really the perfect game!



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Peter Bogert

posted September 17, 2005 at 9:23 am


Kris – Thanks for standing up for the truth!! (grin)



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Royal Farris

posted September 17, 2005 at 10:15 am


Its not about being 350 lbs. Its about being 350 lbs and moving like a cat whith the strength of an elephant. Thats athleticism….



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Royal Farris

posted September 17, 2005 at 10:20 am


Your right…..The strategy of changing out pitchers that can’t go more than an inning or two and the risk of attempting to steal second when the catcher is not ready is exciting to watch….So is chess…It is great to be able to go buy nachos and know you probably won’t miss anything…I hope this conversation is for fun….That’s what I was thinking.
Royal



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Kerry Doyal

posted September 17, 2005 at 10:33 am


Didn’t the Cubs have a reliever who was close to 350? Meyers?



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Scot McKnight

posted September 17, 2005 at 10:43 am


Royal,
All fun. Fire away.



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Scot McKnight

posted September 17, 2005 at 10:45 am


Kerry,
Randy Meyers was probably all of 230. Rick Reuschel was a good size fellow, but maybe the biggest of all was Tim Stoddard, who was 6 foot 8 inches and 250 or 260 (and now he’s a little bigger than that).



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Lukas McKnight

posted September 17, 2005 at 11:23 am


They don’t have to have the quickness of a cat at 350 lbs- just more quickness than the fatter ogre across the line!!!
Baseball, on the other hand, is not so unfair based on size. Look at Billy Wagner- he can be as dominant as any pitcher in baseball!



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Royal Farris

posted September 17, 2005 at 11:31 am


That’s my point Lukas….They are quick as a cat. The question is athleticism.
Fat out of shape pitchers or skinny ones can do well even into middle age in baseball. The fat guys in football have to be in good shape and athletic.
Everyone in football from 160 lbs to 350 lbs has to be in good shape and athletic, has to be smart enough to read complex plays and adjust to complex ofenses and defenses, and have to be able to make those adjustments on the run in order to be successful.
Man I am getting pumped for some Monday Night football….This week, Cowboys vs. Redskins. Are you ready for some football…..



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Scot McKnight

posted September 17, 2005 at 11:44 am


Football names: the Fridge, the Sink, the Hammer.
Baseball names: Pee Wee Reese, the Babe, Dizzy.
Any comparison? Not on your life.



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Royal Farris

posted September 17, 2005 at 12:12 pm


Kansas Comet
Fridge = Willam Perry
Prime Time = Deon Sanders
Mean Joe = Joe Greene
Broadway = Joe Namath
Too Tall = Ed Jones
White Shoes = Billy Jonson
Snake = Kenny Stabler
Bullet = Bob Hayes
Bad Moon = Andre Rison
Assassin = Jack Tatum
Night Train = Dick Lane
Tombstone = Rich Jackson
Freak = Jevon Kearse
Running Backs:
Bambi = Lance Allworth
Galloping Ghost = Red Grange
Crazy Legs = Elroy Hersh
Sweatness = Walter Payton
Juice = OJ Simpson
Nigerian Nightmare = Christian Okoye
Moose = Daryl Johnston
Ironhead = Craig Heyward
Diesel = John Riggins
Bus = Bettis
Blomb Bomber
Minister of Defense
Hacksaw Reynolds
Thank God there are no football players called Pee Wee or Babe, and especially not Dizzy. ALthough there was a guy named wrong way, I think….



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Royal Farris

posted September 17, 2005 at 12:30 pm


‘Wrong Way’ Riegels takes off into history
Cal’s captain loses his bearings and almost scores for the opposition in the Rose Bowl.
By BRUCE LOWITT
© St. Petersburg Times, published September 26, 1999
——————————————————————————–
On Jan. 1, 1929, when Roy Riegels went into the Rose Bowl against Georgia Tech, he was the center and captain of California’s football team.
When he left the field, he was indelibly labeled “Wrong Way” Riegels.
The game was scoreless in the second quarter when the Bears drove to Tech’s 25-yard line before losing the ball on downs. The next play was one of college football’s most famous.
Stumpy Thomason of Georgia Tech was hit by Cal halfback Benny Lom and fumbled at the Tech 30 and Riegels scooped up the ball and took off.
“I was running toward the sidelines,” he said the next day, “and when I picked up the ball I started to turn to my left toward Tech’s goal. Somebody shoved me and I bounded right off into a tough tackler. In pivoting to get away from him, I completely lost my bearings.”
Riegels headed at full speed toward his own goal line, his teammates and Tech players in pursuit with Lom shouting in vain that he was going the wrong way.
Riegels slowed as he approached the end zone and Lom, the first player to reach him, spun him around at the 1-yard line. Instantly Riegels was swarmed under by Tech players.
Cal, unable to advance the ball, had to punt, and Lom’s kick was blocked out of the end zone for a safety. The two points were the difference between winning and losing.
In the Cal locker room at halftime, Riegels put a blanket around his shoulders, put his face in his hands and cried.
After several minutes, coach Clarence “Nibs” Price announced that the second-half starters would be the same as those in the first half.
All but Riegels began heading toward the field.
“Coach, I can’t do it,” he said. “I’ve ruined you. I’ve ruined my school. I’ve ruined myself. I couldn’t face the crowd in that stadium to save my life.”
Price told him, “Roy, get up and go back. The game is only half over.”
According to accounts of the game, Riegels played a brilliant second half, particularly on defense, blocking a Georgia Tech punt.
But Tech scored in the third quarter on a 15-yard run by Thomason (the extra-point kick failed), offsetting Lom’s 10-yard touchdown pass late in the fourth. The extra point left Cal trailing 8-7. That’s how the game ended.



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Kerry Doyal

posted September 17, 2005 at 12:36 pm


from the article: “Stumpy Thomason of Georgia Tech was hit by Cal halfback Benny Lom . . .”
What can one say to Stumpy & Benny Lom?



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Brian

posted September 17, 2005 at 1:21 pm


I’d say their about equal in terms of necessary athletic ability. Different skills needed to be sure, but overall, can’t see how you can rate one better than the other. Now, you want to talk sports that require more overall athleticism, let’s talk hockey. Go Bruins.



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Richard Wagner

posted September 17, 2005 at 3:19 pm


I’m with Royal. If you go purely on the question of ‘what more athletic’ the football example is going to win out. There are many more out of shape non athletic guys in MLB than there are in NFL, percentage wise anyway. If those guys get out of shape and can no longer perform athletically, they sit the bench or get cut. It’s just not like that in baseball.
Scott, maybe your question should have been which is more exciting, or awe inspiring, or something like that. Those fit better with your description of the two scenarios.
Anyway, my two cents. I usually get ignored here, so I’ll slink back to my corner… :)



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Kerry Doyal

posted September 17, 2005 at 5:24 pm


Richard, I’ll take your bait. Yes, since round is a shape, football guys win. Now back to your corner… with the remote, chips, a Vols Hat & pray down fire on the Gators.
FYI: Matt Kynes – a QB for Gators – is a godly EFCA PK.



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Lukas McKnight

posted September 17, 2005 at 5:26 pm


Quick as cats they are not? 5.0 in the 40 yard dash? I can run that easily, and I was a slow catcher!



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Kerry Doyal

posted September 17, 2005 at 5:55 pm


Quick, not fast. Sudden bursts, not swift sprints. BTW – even leopards can not sustain 60 MPH for long (like any one would confuse a lineman for one of those).



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Bradley Nelson

posted September 17, 2005 at 6:43 pm


I can see where you are going with this a 5 oz. ball or a small car driving at you at full speed. Yes I do believe I see your point. Go Titans.



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Lukas McKnight

posted September 17, 2005 at 8:34 pm


I bet there’s not one lineman in the NFL that could touch a 95 mph fastball.
I bet there’s more than a handful of guys in the ML that could put on some weight and be as quick as some of the lugs on the OL in the NFL.
What fun!



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Nick Farris

posted September 17, 2005 at 9:02 pm


The question of athletecism calls for little controversy. If a player came into an NFL training camp looking like David Wells he would be laughed off the field. Name one player in the major leagues who has the pure, God given talent of Jevon Kearse…6-4, 265 pounds, runs a 4.5 forty yard dash and has a 40 inch vertical and you may begin the argument for superior athletecism of MLB. The patience and HAND-EYE COORDINATION to discern the difference between a 95 mph and a 80 mph curveball with a mixed in 75 mph change up is incredible. However, a lineman of 300 pounds running a sub 5 second forty defies all norms of athletecism.
The argument for major league baseball having an edge can only be confirmed with the aspect of the mind. This point is nullified. The ability of a quarterback to read a defense and decide which of his 4 receivers to throw to while defenses mask their 1,2,3,4 zone sets with various man options and QB spies is equal if not greater than the ability to decide whether or not to swing at a ball, because it happens about as fast. By the same token, the defense in football must react with an equally succinct motion. To keep up with receivers who run 4.3 forties (maybe 3 players in MLB run that)and running backs who do about the same while deciphering the complex mind of a quarterback, a certain type of athletic-intelligent hybrid is required.
Either side is exciting and amazing. To watch Barry Bonds hit dingers and Andruw Jones make circus catches in the outfield is as fun to watch as LaDanian Tomlinson (go Horned Frogs) break tackles and outrun defenders for a touchdown. However, the Athletecism lies in the sport where much more padding is required.
And how bout them Cowboys!!!



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Matt Judkins

posted September 18, 2005 at 3:55 pm


Some great baseball nicknames to remember
Walter “Big Train” Johnson – the best IMHO
“The Splendid Splinter” Ted Williams
Mordecai “Three Fingers” Brown
Paul “Poison” Waner & Lloyd “Little Poison” Waner
“Rapid” Robert Feller
Bob “Death to Flying Things” Ferguson



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Ron Fay

posted September 18, 2005 at 10:41 pm


Of course you all fail to realize that hockey takes more athletic skill than either baseball or football, but of those two, baseball obviously takes more skill and athleticism. After all, in football you work for 5 seconds, then break for about 25, then work for five. In baseball, you keep going.
Of course in hockey, it is kill or be killed, and it takes real skill to be a tiny guy and yet be the best on the ice (a la Gretzky or Fleury).
- Ron



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Scot McKnight

posted September 18, 2005 at 10:49 pm


Hockey is nothing but soccer on ice; soccer is a European sport. nuf said.



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Fr'nklin

posted September 19, 2005 at 12:19 am


I only know of one man who loves baseball (Clevland Indians), loves basketball (UNC…God help him), loves football (Panthers…), and loves NASCAR (Jeff Gordon all day long)…and that’s my Dad…but NEVER soccer or hockey!
I tried to learn how to like baseball from him, but it was just too hot…and too slow, and on “Tobacco Road”, well, if it didn’t bounce, we didn’t play with it.



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bberger

posted September 19, 2005 at 1:41 pm


This is actually a pretty fun conversation. You’ve sparked some hot debate; it kind of reminds me of the Corinthians. We can’t all be an eye, can we? :)
I don’t care what sport you’re talking about, when you get a chance to watch the best of the best do their thing, it is a site to behold. However, I like to watch the gargantuan ballerinas with pads.



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Scot McKnight

posted September 19, 2005 at 2:19 pm


The best athletes are in basketball; the most difficult thing to do is hit a baseball. All football requires for many of them is a big fast body and enough marbles in the head to slam into others at full speed. Some of the marbles, of course, get lost along the way.
And how ’bout them Bears!
On a day the Bears win and the Packers lose I find myself in reveries.



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Evan Vanderbilt

posted September 19, 2005 at 6:20 pm


clearly some people have never played baseball. If you’re not up to bat in baseball, you’re standing in the field in hopes that you get a chance to move. If you do, you grab it, throw it to its intended location, and slowly walk back to where you started. A lucky/busy player gets 5 balls hit to him in one game.



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Ron Fay

posted September 19, 2005 at 11:30 pm


Baseball is stickball except you get paid millions. If you have ever watched a Blackhawks game live at Chicago Stadium/the United Center, you’ll never mock hockey again (unless you saw them play the Whalers).



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Ben

posted September 21, 2005 at 12:50 am


I was waiting for someone to talk about basketball. Now there’s a sport for you. Talk about making decisions on the fly. I don’t know if there’s another sport out there like it, where so much of the game is played that way: five guys making split-second decisions within a loose framework. A half-second separates a fast break from a turnover in basketball. It’s a very fast game that relies a lot on rapid cognition, almost like recognizing things before they start happening. QBs have to make those kinds of decisions, and RBs to a certain extent, but the other 10 guys don’t have the same responsibility. In baseball, the guy swinging the bat needs to be able to do that, but the other 9 guys no the field don’t, really. Basketball requires all 10 to be thinking and moving that way. I think basketball wins.



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