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A Pagan in the Buckle: thoughts on my time at a Pentecostal service

I have been slow in writing this post because I have wanted to do my experience justice.  In late November I crossed the country, stopping off in Lawrence Kansas for Thanksgiving with family before returning to California.  Starting from the east coast, on my way to Kansas I visited friends who had moved to Springfield, Missouri.  As much as any place Springfield probably deserves  to be called the “buckle on the Bible Belt” and is certainly not noted for its Pagan community.  There might be one, but if so I did not have the pleasure of meeting any.  Instead I stayed with an old friend from college and his wife, who is an ordained minister in the Assemblies of God, the largest Pentecostal denomination in the United States and a major force within conservative Christianity.


I arrived Saturday, and Sunday they invited me to a meeting at the James River Assembly of God,  a megachurch just outside Springfield.  I have never been interested in attending or listening to Southern Baptists, but the Pentecostals have always interested me. Their focus is on personal interaction with the Holy Spirit rather than exclusively on a crabbed, selective, and heartless parsing of Biblical texts.

Some of their congregations are known for speaking in tongues and other manifestations of their encounter with Spirit. Years ago when I worked at a healing center in Berkeley oriented towards Brazilian Umbanda we learned a great deal about such phenomena, although there was no speaking in tongues.  A wonderful Black woman there visited a Black Pentecostal church in San Francisco and reported to me that the energies appeared to her to be the same, but that the congregation seemed less knowledgeable as to how to work with them.  Karen’s report made me permanently curious to see for myself, though I never made it to the San Francisco group.


Their openness to direct encounters with Spirit has also made them disreputable in the eyes of many mainstream churches, and some conservative Evangelical churches regard them as possessed by demons. For them God somehow decided not to communicate with people directly after Jesus.  Maybe He was tired.  Interestingly, the Pentecostals are also much more open to the role of women in positions of authority, as with their having women ministers. This is interesting to me in my social science guise because openness to such phenomena is traditional greater among women than among men in Asia, Africa and Latin America.

Do not misunderstand me.  These folks are not liberal Christians although at least some do not reject science in favor of such mindless silliness as taking Genesis “literally.” I am pretty sure their voting patterns have little if any overlap with my own.  Michele Bachmann  and Sarah Palin   are members of the Assemblies of God. There is much within the denomination to worry those of us who believe that government should be under the control of citizens rather than those who think they know their God’s plans.  While my friends knew I was a Pagan, most did not.  But if that were all there was to it, there would be no need to write this post.


But there is more to it.

Chaged views of Christianity

I have been trying to understand the mixes of spiritual truth and darkness in Christianity ever since I became a Pagan.  In the years before becoming a Pagan I had become intensely anti-Christian.  The fear and pain involved of working myself free from the deeply instilled fear that my brief flirtation with a variety of fundamentalism had instilled a deep antagonism.  I am sure many readers can appreciate this.  However, after having a series of spiritual experiences that made me a Pagan,  I had to rethink my blanket anti-Christian attitude.  If Spirit was immanent within the world then everything in the world had some kind of connection to it, however small or misunderstood.  Even Christianity. To the surprise of some Evangelicals I interacted with in an interfaith conference, becoming Pagan mellowed my outlook on Christianity.


I have come to look at Christianity as one vehicle among many by which people could try and bring themselves into better harmony with Spirit. There was Torquemada but there was also St. Francis, for every corrupt minister and stone-hearted parishnoer there were others with good hearts who found meaning in their services and rituals, meaning that helped make them better people.  Some were attracted to Power, others to the Sacred.  Should we become a well established and numerous community I am sure we will find the same variety among us, although currently there are not enough “perks” to attract many of the worst sort.

Like us Pagans, Christians sincerely attracted to Spirit faced the problem of understanding what was beyond the power of words to communicate.  I and many Pagans take our lessons from nature, Christians from scripture, and for some such as Pentecostals and Quakers, also from personal encounter.  I have no doubt my approach is best for me, but I can not be dismissive of the approaches followed by others.


I also had to take seriously the fact that while the criticisms of Christianity by many atheists were often well taken, it was equally true that other Christian denominations had developed in wonderful directions, the Quakers for one.  Very interestingly, the reason the Quakers got that name was because they were also personally often taken over by the power of what they thought of as the Holy Spirit. Quakers quaked. They also increasingly  put personal revelation and openness of heart in place of the crabbed readings of theologians and ministers.  The fruits the Quakers left to European civilization are wonderful, most spectacularly in initiating the abolition of slavery, one of humankind’s oldest institutions while the Biblical literalists condemned them as heretics and argued God approved of slavery. Today as I understand it, Quakers no longer “quake,” but many churches still practice collective silence until someone is moved by Spirit to speak. I have been deeply impressed with the Quakers I have met.


The Service

It is from this rather complex perspective that I attended services at the James River church. It was unlike any church I had entered, resembling more a combination of mall and concert hall. The building was huge, with room for some thousand attendees. It seemed as if the most devoted members could spend their entire non-working or sleeping hours there if they wanted, and some likely did.  The main assembly room was huge, with a spacious stage.  As I entered with my friends a rock band started playing devotional Christian music.

They were good, very good and their music was lively.  Devotional did not necessarily translate to “Rock of Ages.”  The music had zip and zing and audience of mostly younger families began to stand and sway and sometimes sing with the music.  The songs were mostly if not entirely about God’s love.  Compared to what I had expected from what I had heard about Pentecostal services, it was pretty sedate, but compared to any Christian gathering I had even seen, it was very lively and the energy was good. A giant screen behind the musicians broadcast their faces so no matter how far away we were we could see them.


I thought this was a “pre-service” event, and as I had my camera with me, I started taking pictures.  Immediately someone came up and very politely said it was fine to take pictures, but I could not use a flash.  The place was dark enough that without a flash pictures were impossible.  But much more importantly, the music was actually a part of the service.  Had I known, I never would have been so disrespectful as to try and photograph it.  It would have been like taking pictures of a circle casting while a guest.  Embarrassed, I put my camera down and never thought of photography again till it was over.

While the “packaging”  of the music was entirely alien (I prefer small groups and meeting in nature), the message seemed to me a good one.  No words about Hell, no references to fear, no talk of “us versus them.” It was positive.


What about the energy?

My years of shamanic training have made me quite open to what I call “spiritual energy,”  and as I said, one of the things I most hoped to experience was the kinds of energies Pentecostals are known for having.  I was not entirely disappointed.  It was definitely there although standing in a row of theater seats made it hard to “go with it.”  And indeed, I did not see anyone else in the congregation get very taken with Spirit at the time, although their involvement was far more bodily and joyous than I had ever seen in any church I had ever been in, be it High Church Episcopal or a Fundamentalist gathering. I suspect a smaller congregation, where people were less spectators and more participants, would have brought in more lively behavior.  My friends told me that was precisely what happened in smaller churches with older participants.  If I make it to Springfield perhaps they will take me to such a service.


After the music ended James Lindell, the pastor, arrived and at first reported on charitable activities within the community, which included work rebuilding homes destroyed by the tornado this past May. Hundreds of food baskets had been created and a giving tree established.

The pastor then asked if people had need of healing, and for those who did to come to the front .  I was disappointed because they then disappeared with people assigned I assume to do healing work on them.  My own years of healing work made me very curious as to how they did theirs. But I could not see what was done, let along experience the quality of energies involved. Perhaps a smaller more traditional church would have been different.


Lindell then gave his sermon, which was different from any Christian sermon I had heard before, and again, as with the singing I could largely agree with its concrete content which was essentially a focus on divine love and that the greatest sin was self-righteousness.  The masks of Spirit were strange to me, but the inner meaning seemed right on.

Obviously these folks were not Southern Baptists. Nor did they seem at all similar to Bachmann or Palin.  Politics was never mentioned, anger never directed at anybody.

I have since thought a great deal about the service, the open and friendly people I met, and how I enjoyed much of it without being tempted even in the slightest to reconsider my own Pagan beliefs.  The Assemblies of God could bring forth a service such as I experienced, where nothing in the message seemed off to me, and they could also give us the likes of Sarah Palin and Michelle Bachmann and their efforts to subordinate democracy to theocracy. (Yet I imagine many in the Springfield community would vote for one of these, given the chance.)  And here is where I think there is hope for the Assemblies of God, and for us all, in a way I think is vastly more difficult for the Southern Baptists.


The individual churches are self-governing and also choose their ministers.  I imagine the kinds of nastiness or corrupt opportunism that comes from centralized hierarchies is absent whereas as I understand it the original decentralization of the Southern Baptists has been seriously compromised. But this is not enough.

In addition, these congregations are open to Spirit in other than written form, or in the words of someone claiming to speak for God.  Each person is individually open to inspiration, at least in principle. The tensions between dead dogma and living Spirit are always highest when people are themselves open to Spirit and so can question with confidence someone’s interpretation of what scripture says.  The Springfield community, my friends told me, were not Biblical ‘literalists.’ (Neither are the ‘literalists,’ but that’s another topic.)


Such groups can evolve. They can learn and grow, just as many of us have deepened our understanding the longer we remain Pagans.

If the mix of good and bad that seems to me to be such an intimate part of the Assemblies of God can shift towards politics and seeking power and dominion, the bad, it can also shift towards personal devotion and service.  While the former deeply scares me with the violence that always accompanies those who think they speak for God in telling others what to do and how to live as soon as they believe they have the power to coerce, it is also able to shift in the direction of genuine service to Spirit in the form it presents itself to them.

The Southern Baptists seem a lost cause to me, permanently distorted by their having been so identified in their own minds with slavery and the Confederacy and trapped in the spiritual death of confusing their understanding of words written long ago with Spirit’s demands on the world today.  The Assemblies of God on the other hand are open to rethinking those words by virtue of the experiences they have personally, experiences that in this instance at least put heart and spirit ahead of the spiritual death of texts worshipped but never understood.  Christianity gave us the Quakers and maybe, just maybe, something as good for people will arise again in Missouri.


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Apuleius Platonicus

posted January 24, 2012 at 11:59 am

I know you are focussing on the “personal” here, rather than the “political”, but Pentecostalism is a huge worldwide social movement, and as such it has an overwhelmingly negative impact on humanity. In particular, Pentecostalists are at the forefront of missionary efforts to finish the job of “conversion” in Africa and the Americas, where previous missionaries have allowed a great deal of the indigenous religious traditions to survive.

For Pentecostalists there is no such thing as an acceptable amount of syncretism. This is generally true of nearly all “evangelical” missionaries (inclusive of not just Baptists but also Mormons, 7th Day Adventists, Jehovah’s Witnesses, etc) currently at hard at work in Africa and the Americas.

The bottom line is that evangelical and/or pentecostalist Christianity unambiguously represents a reversion to medieval theocratic Christianity. These people are first and foremost committed to the total extirpation of all non-Christian religions anywhere and everywhere on the face of the earth. And the Assemblies of God are a prime representative of this.

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Gus diZerega

posted January 24, 2012 at 2:07 pm

Apuleius is right and the crimes he mentions are another piece in the complex web of connections and tensions that make up modern religion. I did not mention them for the reason he gives. But it is important, very much so. Let me elaborate.

On Africa a taste of the crimes being committed is available here : .

In Latin America a sad example of mass slaughter is described in Virginia Garrard-Burnett “Terror in the Land of the Holy Spirit: Guatemala under General Efraín Ríos Montt, 1982-1983.” The butcher Montt was very popular in American conservative religious circles.

The great spiritual sin of Christianity (to use their terminology) is their belief that they have a monopoly on spiritual truth and that they are justified in imposing their views as a result, The millions killed in the name of that belief are rivaled only by the greatest slaughters in history. During the 30 Years War in Europe 1/3 the population of Germany and what is now the Czech Republic were killed. Slaughter in the name of Jesus is a time honored tradition when the killers believe they have both the power and the opportunity. Were it not for groups such as Quakers I would hold no hope at all for this religion as anything but totalitarianism either incipient needing only power, or explicit once it has the power. But the Quakers exist, and today others as well.

My post was my description of a particular church and what I experienced there, and most importantly, of what might someday lead to an improvement in how conservative Christians approach other religions. For them, as for us all I think, the key questions is whether those who think they speak for Spirit believe they should use political power against those who disagree because their God is too weak to accomplish his goals otherwise rather than by simply setting an example others would find attractive (as I experienced in Springfield).

Until the latter happens there will always be a powerful tension between the basic decency many people have and what they believe their God tells them to do.

I guess at the bottom what is important is: are people kind because they believe God wants them to be (in which case they can become murderous if they later believe God wants that as well) or are people kind because they want to be, either through spiritual growth and encounter with the Sacred or by some other means. Only the latter is genuine kindness and only it is trustworthy. The rest is just following orders. See my post “A Pagan Lesson for an Evangelical.”

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posted January 25, 2012 at 12:54 pm

Gus, I wonder if you have ever been to a black church? The spirit there is similar to what you describe among the Adventists (althoough not necessariy the message). The music is ecstatic and contagious.

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posted January 25, 2012 at 1:38 pm

Interesting description of your impressions.

I suspect that, no matter if we hold that Spirit and energies are potentially accessible by Christian adherents and denominations, that most Pagan practitioners would find that they are dampered down compared to typical Pagan workings.

And I will admit that some Christian personalities and saints, like St. Francis of Assisi, do seem more in touch with Earth energies and processes and life.

I particularly appreciate the phrase “heartless parsing of Biblical texts.” The more intricately they parse, the deader and harder seem to grow their hearts.

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posted January 25, 2012 at 8:56 pm

They were good, very good and their music was lively. Devotional did not necessarily translate to “Rock of Ages.”

Darn, no Def Leppard? 😛

Seriously, though, I’m glad you had a good experience. For my part, it’s good to hear that there are, in fact, non-fanatical Pentecostal churches. (My cousin is being pulled by his local Pentecostal church in a very Sauronic direction, and the rest of the family has been trying in vain to get him to see reason.)

@Vesta: I’ve been to a Catholic church in Selma, Alabama. (Yes, there is a Catholic church in Selma.) It was a rather odd combination of the basic form of the Mass with the lively spiritual music you encounter in most black churches. To give you an idea: the closing hymn was “I’ve Got The Joy.” At a Catholic church.

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posted January 26, 2012 at 1:37 pm

“The tensions between dead dogma and living Spirit are always highest when people are themselves open to Spirit and so can question with confidence someone’s interpretation of what scripture says”

I believe you just hit the proverbial nail right on the head. Thank you for sharing this experience. I’ve had some good interaction with some Pentacostal folks myself, though I’d almost forgotten it. I still hold on to some of the beliefs I was raised with but my willingness to see and accept Divinity as something beyond labels didn’t sit too well with my Christian family. It has not been an easy separation. Thanks for reminding me how diverse this community can be!

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Richard Morgan

posted April 22, 2012 at 5:46 pm

In the book Trees of Life: The Genetic Code of God’s Children by Richard Morgan, one of the chapters refers to a certain Religion as the very forceps of the Master Abortionist in Spiritual Partial Birth Abortion. A form of Christianity that rejects grace, truly is the sign of the times.

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posted January 17, 2015 at 6:48 pm

As A Christian and Pentecostal based..I found your writing excellent, non threatening, truthful and very nice without attack.

Yes we are a different breed. But that is what the Spirit does within us. I personally do not like dead churches or fundementalists or liturgical christian’s that lose the meaning. God is love and accepting of all, after all if he was not I would not be in this boat..for God has accepted me. In order for rationale people to dialogue we must be open to others and understand. That is clearly what you portrayed here..thank you!

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posted February 5, 2015 at 10:51 pm

I can’t tell you how glad I was to find this post.

I spent 20 years as a member of a fundamentalist pentecostal church. The organization I was part of is to the right of the Assemblies. I was told it would be a sin for me to cut my hair, to wear pants (instead of a skirt), to wear jewelry other than a wedding ring, or any makeup at all.

But there is Spirit in the services. For 20 years I was told that this is the Holy Ghost, God Himself. That this Spirit is very sacred and holy and the only unforgivable sin there is is to blaspheme this Holy Ghost.

Over the past couple years I have left this church and have been drawn to a Pagan path. I’ve begun to do new and full moon meditations, to feel the energies present in nature.

First, at sunrise on the Winter Solstice when I met the returning light with my small fire in my back yard, and since at a couple full moon circles, I’ve begun to feel Spirit again. And I’ve been dying to talk to someone about this because it feels absolutely identical to how I felt speaking in tongues in the pentecostal altar.

I even found my self speaking in tongues at this past full moon, sitting on the ground in my yard, grounded and so full of Spirit and energy I could barely contain myself.

But even as I did, I hear the voice of the old preacher in the back of my head warning me about blasphemy. I’ve had a lot of fear to overcome, fear that I really am worshiping demons now and that Satan himself is going to drag me to Hell. 20 years worth of indoctrination is a lot to overcome!

But I’m very happy to hear that someone else has had a chance to experience Spirit in both places, and that you also recognized the similar energy. I’m not crazy! Perhaps it is the same Divine spirit, only the rest of what goes on in those churches is what is off base.

I’ll definitely be exploring your blog and learning more! Thank you again!

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posted October 25, 2015 at 5:44 am

The relation between two countries is not cordial but that air of antagonism has never stopped or forced any business from withdrawing
any of their business initiatives. The nation got to see how confused and out
of touch with the American people they really are.
Yes, this is the way of the world, but it doesn’t have to be your world.

Thank you for the good writeup. It if truth be told was a
entertainment account it. Glance complex to more added agreeable from you!

However, how could we keep in touch?

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