Mike Huckabee: 'The Lord Truly Gave Me Wisdom'

The Republican presidential candidate discusses feeling God's presence during the debates and improving Christianity's image.

informedattimes

11/04/2009 12:52:33 AM

There is no room for disagreement with the perception that Mike Huckabee 'hates' gays. By that ; I mean ; some issues should never be open to the usual ' informed opposing point of view'. This includes race , ethnicity , racial origin , or sexual orientation. To put it simplistically ; gays have usually been second class citizens or less , but first class taxpayers. It rarely surfaces , but same-sex marriage has nothing to do with marital rights and responsibilities , and everything to do with a pathological and religiously inspired opposition to the very existence of homosexual persons. America is a secular democracy ( republic ). religion is based on faith ; not facts . And gay persons are facts , but have been denied constitutional rights since the founding of the USA. Freedom of religion is sacrosanct . But no freedom gives anyone the right to deny or eliminate the rights of others. The tired adage of hating the sin but loving the sinner ; is a reprehensible sham. Nothing 'loving' has ever come forth from conservative Christians , directed at homosexual persons. On the contrary , the anti-gay rhetoric has never been limited to religious beliefs (Biblical verses) , but is replete with lies , slander , defamation and innuendo. These are erroneously described as beliefs. Beliefs have consequences. And the consequences for America's gays ( and elsewhere globally;) , is violence , bloodshed , and murder.

romneygirl

02/05/2008 11:25:04 AM

I was all excited to look into this website this morning. Disappointment soon set in. Why is there no blog for Romney? I am a Christian, does that mean I need to hate Mormons? It sure seems that way with most Christians I talk to about Romney. The majority of Mormons are excellent people, deceived though they may be.America is not trying to find a new Head Pastor. It desperately needs a well qualified person to lead this country away from socialism and back to capitalism. Pray for Romney's salvation when you cast your vote for him.

Do_unto_others

01/24/2008 12:10:23 PM

Fone_Bone, it is you that seems a bit confused... "all the talk about "amending the Bible to fit the Constitution" Seems YOU did not read the interview, for it is the exact opposite of that: "the Constitution was created as a document that could be changed" Note - NOT the Bible (even tho the Bible HAS been changed many, many times). Huck indeed DOES want to change the Constitution. When asked: "Is it your goal to bring the Constitution into strict conformity with the Bible?" he does not deny it. Trouble is, of course, that he wants to change it to HIS interpretation of the Bible. What would you say if it were a United Church pastor running who wanted to change it to his or her interpretation of the Bible - which ALLOWS same-sex marriage??? Can you not see the danger in selective Biblical interpretation in a land that "promises" freedom of religion to EVERYBODY???

Fone_Bone_2001

01/23/2008 06:15:09 PM

"He does not believe in women's rights. He wants to amend the Constitution to reflect his Christian beliefs." Actually - and this is the heart of the matter - Huckabee does NOT want to amend the Constitution to bring it in line with the Bible. Newsflash: it's not just Christians who believe that one's being an inconvenience to someone else does not negate his or her right to live, nor does one have to be a Christian not to want to change the definition of marriage. As Huckabee says: "The sanctity of human life is not just a religious issue. It’s an issue [...] of all people being equal, endowed by their creator with alienable rights of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness." These are not, at their core, religious issues. The unborn child's right to live does not depend on any religious dogma, but simply on the nearly universal moral assumption that all people have certain inalienable rights. Any of you care to disagree with that principle? I thought not.

Fone_Bone_2001

01/23/2008 06:05:32 PM

Did any of you actually read the interview? Huckabee says he strives for a worldview that's "defensible and intellectually sound, and [...] impacts people's lives in a positive way." He wants "a greater sense of justice, a greater sense of hope, and a decency to the process." He wants to address issues like disease, hunger, poverty, homelessness, the environment. He says taking care of the earth is a matter of stewardship. In fact, all the talk about "amending the Bible to fit the Constitution" came from the QUESTIONS, not Huckabee's actual words! Yet Huckabee has been accused in this thread of HATING gays and lesbians. Does a man who says the kind of things reported in this interview truly seem like he has hate in his heart? Of course not. Disagree with him we may, but to accuse him of hatred crosses the line from legitimate disagreement to slander and a childish inability to cope with the fact that - gasp! - people dare to disagree with your views.

Do_unto_others

01/23/2008 02:33:49 PM

I concur with bristlecone77. The "vitriol", "anger" and "bitterness" of which Fone_Bone speaks is heartfelt not only by women and members of religious communities OTHER than Mr. Huckabee's (or of NO faith at all - that's still allowed in America, isn't it?), but also by gay and lesbian citizens who stand to be ejected from the Constitution's "promise" of equal treatement before the law. I guess Fone_Bone isn't part of any minority and cannot empathize with those who are, for there is valid reason for them to be scared. bristlecone mentions a possible Muslim cnadidate changing the Constitution to make it "more in line with his religious beliefs" (what Huckabee wants to do). Well, what if it were a - gasp! - liberal pastor wanting to 'align' the Constitution to be more attuned with his or her beliefs? The conservative or right-wing crowd would be up in arms for sure. It is Huckabee who is being intolerant when he foolishly proposes such an anti-American tactic. He deserves the anger, imo.

bristlecone77

01/22/2008 11:40:35 AM

Here's another way of looking at it: Supposing a candidate calmly and thoughtfully ran with the philosophy that this is a Muslim country and promised to amend the Constitution applying his Muslim values. Would you have a problem with that? Would that cause a visceral reaction in you? I am a woman. He does not believe in women's rights. I am a pagan. He wants to amend the Constitution to reflect his Christian beliefs. I stand to personally lose a lot if Huckabee is elected. Anyone not his version of Christianity does. Shekah

bristlecone77

01/22/2008 11:28:23 AM

Fone_Bone, Anger has its place. That a man can calmly suggest changing this country to match an intolerant version of Christianity is viscerally terrifying, especially for those of us who will lose our rights under such a president. Also, beware of one who claims to speak for God. Most likely it is his own ego for which he speaks. Christian Mystic Kalil Gibran has been quoted as saying that a true teacher leads you to your wisdom, not his. This rings true. Shekah

nnmns

01/21/2008 08:39:29 PM

You can be as polite and "thoughtful" as you care, but to propose amending out Constitution to suit his little version of his religion is intolerant and should not be tolerated.

Fone_Bone_2001

01/21/2008 07:50:25 PM

Judging by the words in this interview and this discussion, Mike Huckabee has a lot more humility - and a lot less anger and bitterness - than many of you who disagree with him. If you actually read the article, his tone is quite calm and rational. This discussion, by contrast, is positively loaded with vitriol. Everyone certainly has the right to disagree with Huckabee, and the right to vote how they choose and to try to persuade others to do the same, but seriously, people. Don't claim to be champions of freedom and tolerance for all when you have absolutely none for Huckabee's opinions, no matter how thoughtfully and carefully he expresses them.

free4all

01/21/2008 03:42:05 PM

AND, this guy, proves what a legend in his own mind he is when he says this: "Marriage has historically, as long as there’s been human history, meant a man and a woman in a relationship for life. Once we change that definition, then where does it go from there? " Well, marriage ISN'T a relationship for life anymore, is it? Over 50% of them end in DIVORCE, mostly in Red states. Yet, he doesn't propose banning divorce, he just proposes banning gay marriage. He can't think logically, can he? You want him in charge of the nuclear buttons? Not me, no thank you!

free4all

01/21/2008 03:26:03 PM

Huckabee picks and chooses what he wants to believe. He stated in a Republican debate that God definitely created the Heavens and the Earth. But when asked if it was in 6 days, he said, "I can't tell you, I wasn't there." Well, if he can't say how long it took because he wasn't there, then why can he say definitely God did it when he wasn't there? His comparison of a gay man to a sheep is really insulting. I'd go along with it if I had to pay the same income tax or sales tax a sheep does, though.

bristlecone77

01/21/2008 11:49:28 AM

Fornication with animals? Good heavens! What kind of sexual fantasies is Huckabee entertaining? And they call liberals morally weak! Shekah

PurpleKU77

01/21/2008 09:12:10 AM

I think that we should amend the Constitution to declare that this is One Nation Under Hugh Hefner. If he can have it his way, so can I. By the way, I sure hope Huckabee is the Republican nominee, because we will wipe the floor with him!!!

nnmns

01/19/2008 10:36:37 PM

It's 10:40 p.m. ET and they're projecting McCain winner in S.C., which may spell the end of Huckabee's hopes. Here is a short quote from an A.P. article: At least a third of South Carolina Republican voters said it matters a great deal that a candidate shares their religious beliefs, and Huckabee won nearly half of them. But almost as many said the candidate's religious beliefs matter not much or not at all and Huckabee won no more than one in 10 of them, with McCain doing best and Romney behind him among that group.

Daldianus

01/19/2008 07:35:07 AM

myID: I'm always surprised that christian fundies worry so much about people fornicating with animals ........ Ordinary people don't think a tenth as often about those things!?

my_id

01/19/2008 06:23:38 AM

"If the family or church does its own work and does it well, then there’s no reason for government to ever get into these things at all. The ideal is that they wouldn’t, that they’ll do a lousy job of it generally." I don't mind that we have idiots in our country, but how do they get so far in life?? I know some (non-hateful) churches do good work with poverty, but they can't do it all! Some can barely afford to keep their buildings in tact, and we want to dump poverty in their lap? Most sincere churches are doing the best they can, but wouldn't it be great it the government pitched in and helped its own citizens??

my_id

01/19/2008 06:17:22 AM

To all the Europeans out there, see what we have to put up with?!? You know, he says we can't tolerate two dudes or two chicks marrying because the next thing you know, someone will want to marry their dog. Slippery slope, you know. Yet almost immediately after that, he says that just wants to change a couple of things about the constitution, then he'll stop. Really? I don't buy it. I think it's a slippery slope. Today, gay marriage. Tomorrow, no looking at someone with lust in your heart. And THAT would ruin my day.

Daldianus

01/19/2008 04:48:36 AM

The guy is a total nutter and fraud. And regarding the Bible, there isn't even an original Bible! And the wording in the ancient manuscripts is never 100% identical.

Gwyddion9

01/18/2008 09:24:53 PM

I have seen this quote used many times now, when discussing Mr. Huckabee: "When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross" Sinclair Lewis. The more is hear of this man and hear his opinion, i see this quote resoundingly. I have no desire to live in a theocracy, Christian or otherwise.

Do_unto_others

01/18/2008 01:00:05 PM

Dear ilovetogarden, "I am free to worship according to my beliefs. We do not need to become a "Christian nation" in order to behave according our religious beliefs." Of course, there are many, many people of OTHER faiths than the Christian ones in America. Can you imagine if someone of, say, the United Church were running for President and wanted to change the Constitution to parallel his or her beliefs? What an uproar we'd hear from the religious "right", eh? "I fear that we are becoming the very thing we fear from terrorists, zealots, that can tolerate no other religion then their own." Me too. "Mr. Huckabee appears to want to streamline our Constitution to his beliefs." Agreed. He would single handedly destroy the promise of freedom of religion in America. How dangerous this man is.

Do_unto_others

01/18/2008 12:55:51 PM

ctaskins, "Or perhaps we ought not rely on 19th century interpretations and theories as the ultimate standard of credibility." Why shouldn't we do that? Huckabee does, specifically as regards God's gay and lesbian children. How come the religious "right" can do it and the religious "left" can't? Or is that just more selectivity?

Do_unto_others

01/18/2008 12:52:43 PM

"How do Huckabee, and others, justify quoting the bible as a source of moral guidance, when it happens to support their political views, yet ignoring the many passages which do not conform to most people's current sense of morality?" Good question, DJZ. It's called "selective fundamentalism".

Do_unto_others

01/18/2008 12:50:48 PM

Apokalips, You said, "If you don't believe in the Bible you don't have to abide by its rules." If Huckabee gets elected President, that WON'T be the case anymore. Which is what scares the bejeezus out of us.

Do_unto_others

01/18/2008 12:49:18 PM

Apokalips, "Remember Sodom and Gomorrah." Um, we DO. They were destroyed because of great wickedness. The wickedness had nothing to do with homosexuality. It had everything to do with inhospitality. Please read your Bible. You'll find it in Ezekiel. Search for "this was the sin of your sister Sodom". You're in for a BIG surprise. "He got my vote." Now that's just SAD. He wants to tear down the wall between Church and State and wants to mix God's realm with this earthly (political) one. And THAT's just scary. Seems Huck does NOT believe that "ALL men (and presumably women too) are created equal". He tends to favor the betterosexuals. So much for "liberty (whatever happened to THAT?) and JUSTICE for ALL"?

ilovetogarden

01/18/2008 12:45:37 PM

This man scares me. God gives me wisdom too. But my wisdom from God is very different from Mr. Huckabee's. And that is the beauty of our Constitution that I am free to worship according to my beliefs. We do not need to become a "Christian nation" in order to behave according our religious beliefs. I fear that we are becoming the very thing we fear from terrorists, zealots, that can tolerate no other religion then their own. God help those that do not believe the way zealots believe. Mr. Huckabee appears to want to streamline our Constitution to his beliefs. There are many many good points brought up in the preceding posts. Where is the record of his sermons and his journey as pastor and what is it about them that he does not want the rest of us to find out about?

Do_unto_others

01/18/2008 12:45:06 PM

more to Apokalips, You asked: "Gay marriage is already illegal. If God approved of man being with man why didn't he create man and man or woman and woman?" Um, God created BOTH men and women. Most of them are heterosexuals, but not all of them. Is that so difficult to understand?

Do_unto_others

01/18/2008 12:43:01 PM

Apokalips, "what admendment does Governor Huckabee have that says that the United States has to abide by the Bible's rule? Can you tell me exactly where I can find it so that I can read it for myself? I would really appreciate it." From what I understand from your complicated syntax, the answer is that Huckabee wants to change the Constitution to make it more in line with his (Huck's) own theological version of God's Word and his (Huck's) interpretation of what the Bible says. Listen to the links or read a transcript. It is always better to be fore-armed with knowledge before you rant on.

nnmns

01/18/2008 12:09:02 PM

ctaskins, my point about the Bible is not that there's nothing moral in it, my point is that there's a lot that's immoral in it and if we use it as a source for our morality we're likely to get that part, too. As for science, of course it's been wrong. Science is a process and it changes constantly, almost always for the truer. The Bible changes rarely and it's hard to say whether changes make it more true to what may have been originally written but in any case changes are so rare it just doesn't improve as a source of morality. The Bible desperately needs upgrades but there's no sign they will happen. Why should anyone's morality be determined by declarations made back when, for instance, slavery was common practice and accepted by the original writers of the Bible?

ctaskins

01/18/2008 11:41:06 AM

Of course. If 19th century Christians used obscure references in the Bible to justify an immoral practice, then surely the Bible can have nothing in it of any moral worth to anyone. All that stuff about loving one's neighbor as one's self, turning the other cheek, helping the poor, forgiveness, fearlessness, etc., should all collectively be discounted because of a few references to slavery. Also, we should discount science as a trusted source of knowledge because of theories held by 19th century scientists which were also proved false and horribly racist, such as Arthur Gobineau's "An Essay on the Inequality of the Human Races" or Darwin's references to "negresses" as almost animalistic in "On the Origin of Species." Or perhaps we ought not rely on 19th century interpretations and theories as the ultimate standard of credibility.

nnmns

01/18/2008 11:37:59 AM

I'd like to know why Huckabee is keeping his old sermons as secret as he can. His old churches claim they aren't available and his campaign won't release them. What's in there he's ashamed of?

nnmns

01/18/2008 11:35:32 AM

Here's a quote from Huckabee's book Kids Who Kill: "Abortion, environmentalism, AIDS, pornography, drug abuse, and homosexual activism have fragmented and polarized our communities." So Huckabee puts environmentalism in the same category as pornography' drug abuse and homosexual activities (presumably all of them), clearly activities he considers sinful. I think that shows how much concern for the air we breath and the water we drink we can expect from a Huckabee administration.

nnmns

01/18/2008 10:37:49 AM

Here are a few quotes from this site about slavery by Christians in the 19'th century. It should convince anyone (cknuck, are you reading this?) that the Bible is no place to get moral inspiration. "[Slavery] was established by decree of Almighty God...it is sanctioned in the Bible, in both Testaments, from Genesis to Revelation...it has existed in all ages, has been found among the people of the highest civilization, and in nations of the highest proficiency in the arts." Jefferson Davis, President of the Confederate States of America. "There is not one verse in the Bible inhibiting slavery, but many regulating it. It is not then, we conclude, immoral." Rev. Alexander Campbell

DJZ

01/18/2008 09:22:30 AM

What struck me as most illogical and misleading of Huckabee's statements, was his reference to slavery. Combined with his other comments, he would seem to imply the US Constitution was changed to conform with the biblical truth that slavery is wrong. In fact, the bible says no such thing, and would, to the contrary seem to condone slavery. Long after the bible was written, mankind came to the conclusion, which now seems obvious, that slavery is immoral. How do Huckabee, and others, justify quoting the bible as a source of moral guidance, when it happens to support their political views, yet ignoring the many passages which do not conform to most people's current sense of morality?

nnmns

01/17/2008 08:22:46 PM

Apokalypsis: "nnmns: what admendment does Governor Huckabee have that says that the United States has to abide by the Bible's rule?" His proposal for anti-abortion and anti-gay marriage ammendments. Weren't you paying attention? "In response to the 'cloned meat' comment. ... Also, based on the information I've heard and read, cloned meat is not being sold in the U.S. I'm fairly sure that when and if it is sold that the FDA will have a set of rules and regulations initiated that will ensure that consumers know that the products are from cloned animals." You need to read the news. FDA has approved it with no restrictions or labeling requirements. You don't know your FDA under GWB. So again if the fact something important to people has always been done one way is cause for a constitutional amendment, it's time for the "Defense of Meat" amendment that defines meat as from uncloned animals.

bristlecone77

01/17/2008 07:39:29 PM

I believe gays should be allowed to marry. This has relevance to my spiritual path. Why can't gays marry except by virtue that fundamentalists don't want them to? Shekah

Apokalypsis

01/17/2008 07:22:43 PM

Dinnertime! Good night all. I enjoyed the conversations and debates. Revelation

Apokalypsis

01/17/2008 07:14:55 PM

bristlecone77: I guess I should have used the below example from the Declaration of Independence: When in the Course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation. ALSO:We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights

Apokalypsis

01/17/2008 07:04:11 PM

bristlecone77: Can you give me an example of where "Christians are forcing other Americans to abide by Christian teaching"? I haven't read any reports of Americans being beheaded, flogged, or imprisoned if they choose to be an Atheist, Wiccan or Muslim.

bristlecone77

01/17/2008 07:03:01 PM

Okay, the Lord gave me wisdom. I am right. It is from His mouth to mine. You must obey. Shekah

Apokalypsis

01/17/2008 06:55:40 PM

nnmns: Are you saying that God did not give you wisdom? I know He gave me wisdom. Based on the comments I've been reading on this board, He gave everyone here the wisdom to be able to hold intelligent debates on a variety of topics. What's wrong with a person telling everyone what God has blessed them with?

bristlecone77

01/17/2008 06:52:42 PM

"In God we Trust" and "One Nation Under God" were both added during the McCarthy era in the middle of the Twentieth Century, not during the founding of this country. Shekah

Apokalypsis

01/17/2008 06:47:43 PM

nnmns: what admendment does Governor Huckabee have that says that the United States has to abide by the Bible's rule? Can you tell me exactly where I can find it so that I can read it for myself? I would really appreciate it.

Apokalypsis

01/17/2008 06:43:31 PM

nnmns: Just because other countries performing same sex marriages doesn't mean that we have to follow their lead. Do you know why America is the strongest nation in the world? It's because America's foundation is God and not man: "in God we trust" "One nation under God". America is a Christian nation, not a secular nation, which is why God has blessed it with such fortune. In response to the 'cloned meat' comment. Governor Huckabee is not in office, therefore he can't propose an admendment against selling clone meat. Also, based on the information I've heard and read, cloned meat is not being sold in the U.S. I'm fairly sure that when and if it is sold that the FDA will have a set of rules and regulations initiated that will ensure that consumers know that the products are from cloned animals.

Apokalypsis

01/17/2008 06:42:45 PM

FormerFundie: I love my country and I'm not the one complaining about the way it's being ran. Governor Huckabee is simply running for office, just like Senator Clinton, which is their right as citizens. Noone is trying to 'overthrow' anything. nnmns: I have never understood why people throws comments totally off base into a conversation, when they don't have a valid point. i.e. "God approving of comuputers????" The Bible doesn't say anything about God approving of a six year old kid watching cartoons while eating candy on a Saturday afternoon either. Can you see that neither of these statements make any sense in relation to God or the Bible. I wasn't picking randomly, I was just having an interesting debate with bristlecone77 and others.

bristlecone77

01/17/2008 06:24:34 PM

But, Apokalypsis, it is okay for Christians to force other Americans to abide by Christian teachings. Nice. Shekah

nnmns

01/17/2008 06:13:26 PM

'The Lord Truly Gave Me Wisdom' but apparently no humility; whom does that remind me of?

nnmns

01/17/2008 06:06:25 PM

"If you don't believe in the Bible you don't have to abide by its rules." I'm glad to see you say that, Apokalypsis, because it must mean you oppose Huckabee's amendments.

Apokalypsis

01/17/2008 06:02:07 PM

If you don't believe in the Bible you don't have to abide by its rules. Although God created man for His pleasure,He gave him free will to live life however he wish. I believe that the Bible is God's gift to man to teach us how to live. The good thing about being a Christian and living in America is that we're not forced to abide by anyone's religion. Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created. Reveltion 4:11

nnmns

01/17/2008 05:43:33 PM

'No, I was specifically talking about those two issues. Those were the only two issues I spoke about in the speech, and that was the point. I’m not suggesting that we say, “Okay, the Bible says you should tithe, so now in the Constitution we’re going to amend it to say everyone tithes.”' Huckabee is taking it upon himself to choose certain issues, issues Jesus apparently cared nothing about or at least so little as to have said nothing about them, and try to pass Constitutional amendments about them, but to leave other issues, such as divorce which I understand Jesus opposed strongly, unopposed. You can't get much less Biblical than that. Or will he only get around to other issues like divorce and stoning people who sass their parents after he's elected?

nnmns

01/17/2008 05:37:02 PM

"Marriage has historically, as long as there’s been human history, meant a man and a woman in a relationship for life." I'm not sure how true that is in ancient history but it's false in recent history. Same sex marriages are performed in Belgium, Canada, South Africa, Spain and The Netherlands. They are recognized in Israel. So the horse is well out of the barn. And several states offer civil unions; does Huckabee want to ban those? If so he's straying out of "marriage". If not, potential supporters might want to know that. On the other hand, it is literally true that for as long as humans have eaten meat, they've eaten uncloned meat. (Except possibly for the last couple of years, though that's been denied.) And a lot of people really don't want to eat cloned meat, which they may soon do because it will be all mixed in with the rest of the meat on the market. Why hasn't Huckabee proposed a constitutional amendment against selling cloned meat?

bristlecone77

01/17/2008 05:36:08 PM

The truth is, you do live in a pluralistic nation. Huckabee will not change that even if he started another Inquisition, it will not happen. Shekah

FormerFundie

01/17/2008 05:10:57 PM

Apokalypsis, let me make this very simple for you. If you and Governor Schmuckabee wish to live in a nation where religion controls the rule of law, then move to Iran. Neither you, Osama bin Laden, or Governor Schmuckabee shall be permitted to overthrow the Constitution of the United States in the name of religion and theocracy.

FormerFundie

01/17/2008 05:08:22 PM

It is disheartening that Governor Schmuckabee is the new face of fundamentalist politics in America. You'd think that with millions of followers, the clan could raise up someone with more tact.

nnmns

01/17/2008 05:06:55 PM

"Can someone please give the book, chapter and verse in the Bible that says that God approves of same sex marriage? I've been searching for a while now and I'm not able to find anything." Show me where "God" approves of computers. You can't yet you use them. It's convenient for you to use a computer so you are for it, you have no desire to mary someone of your sex, I presume, so you are against it, but neither is mentioned in the Bible. You are just picking the things not mentioned in the Bible you like.

FormerFundie

01/17/2008 05:06:48 PM

Following a question regarding younger generations being turned off by outspoken and zealous fundamentalists, Huckabee says: "I would hope not. I think it would be very tragic. I would hope that if that’s the case that I’ve not contributed to it. I would like to think quite the opposite, that I’ve made that people realize that Christians are real people and they have a real world view that’s defensible and intellectually sound, and that it impacts people’s lives in a positive way." Later on, Governor Huckabee contributes to the very same rhetoric that irritates the young generation by equating homosexuality with bestiality and pedophilia by saying: "I think the radical view is to say that we’re going to change the definition of marriage so that it can mean two men, two women, a man and three women, a man and a child, a man and animal." Those words are exactly why people like me now reject Fundamentalism and the culture of hate and exclusivity associated with it.

FormerFundie

01/17/2008 05:06:33 PM

Following a question regarding younger generations being turned off by outspoken and zealous fundamentalists, Huckabee says: "I would hope not. I think it would be very tragic. I would hope that if that’s the case that I’ve not contributed to it. I would like to think quite the opposite, that I’ve made that people realize that Christians are real people and they have a real world view that’s defensible and intellectually sound, and that it impacts people’s lives in a positive way." Later on, Governor Huckabee contributes to the very same rhetoric that irritates the young generation by equating homosexuality with bestiality and pedophilia by saying: "I think the radical view is to say that we’re going to change the definition of marriage so that it can mean two men, two women, a man and three women, a man and a child, a man and animal." Those words are exactly why people like me now reject Fundamentalism and the culture of hate and exclusivity associated with it.

bristlecone77

01/17/2008 04:55:43 PM

You speak as though I believe in the Bible or as you believe. Answer me this then: Why must I abide by rules laid out by a Bible I do not believe in? To me they are not the rules of God. They are the rules of man. If I fall in love with a woman, why must I be forced to abide by your religion and not my own? Shekah

Apokalypsis

01/17/2008 04:32:15 PM

I call that a non-answer, bristlecone77. Here's the answer to your question: And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul. Genesis 2:7

bristlecone77

01/17/2008 04:25:56 PM

Can someone please give the book, chapter and verse in the Bible that says that God approves of breathing? Shekah

Apokalypsis

01/17/2008 04:14:31 PM

Can someone please give the book, chapter and verse in the Bible that says that God approves of same sex marriage? I've been searching for a while now and I'm not able to find anything.

bristlecone77

01/17/2008 03:53:30 PM

Well, heck, Apokalypsis, at least my marriage is safe. It really is all about me, isn't it? Maybe if I look at it that way, I should vote for Huckabee. Shekah

bristlecone77

01/17/2008 03:49:09 PM

I stood on a street corner and held a sign for a referendum that allowed domestic partnerships in my state. Instead, a law that said marriage was exclusively between a man and a woman was passed. Thus the institute of marriage was cheapened. It turned from a relationship about love and devotion into a cheap Walmart piece of trash. Shekah

nnmns

01/17/2008 03:49:02 PM

"I think that whether someone is a Christian or not, the idea that a human life has dignity and intrinsic worth should be clear enough. ... That’s the real issue." Here he's saying it's not a religious issue but a moral one. He's realized the religious approach, while appealing to his right wing Christian base, won't fly with the majority of Americans so he's backing away from it. Too late, he's already on record and even if it's not used in the primaries (strategy issue for opposing candidates) it can be used if he's nominated. I don't know how this backing off will fly with the right wing Christians. And if he wants to amend the constitution on these issues based on morality, it's frivolous. There are far more pressing issues such as global warming and the economy and hunger and on and on.

bristlecone77

01/17/2008 03:46:00 PM

If what you say is true, Apokalypsis, please feel free to annul my heterosexual marriage. I had assumed I married him because I love him, not because he is a man and I am a woman. In actively denying those who love each other the right to marry because they are of the same gender, you have denigrated my marriage. What you want denigrates love and therefore denigrates God, Bible or no Bible. Shekah

bristlecone77

01/17/2008 03:42:31 PM

Last I checked, marriage is about love, not about structure. Do you have the right to judge these people? Do you have the right to say they cannot be married? God gave us brains so we could figure things out. If he wanted unquestioning obedience to the Bible, we would have been created without frontal lobes. Shekah

nnmns

01/17/2008 03:40:16 PM

"my point is, the Constitution was created as a document that could be changed. That’s the genius of it. The Bible, however, was not created to be amended and altered with each passing culture" The history of the Bible is rife with conflicts, editings, burnings at the stake, canonizations, etc. To try to use it as a basis for the Constitution of a nation of all sorts of believers and non-believers is senseless and divisive. To claim it's not been changed is to ignore its history It does not strike me as a book to be revered or to consider unchangeable. It is clearly a book some people respect and others don't. And it's our right to do either. And while our Constitution has been and can be changed, that should not be done on a whim or because some guy wants to win a primary. It is a sign of disrespect of our traditions that Huckabee treats it so cavalierly.

Apokalypsis

01/17/2008 03:34:43 PM

Gay marriage is already illegal. If God approved of man being with man why didn't he create man and man or woman and woman? And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man. Genesis 2:22 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh. Genesis 2:24

bristlecone77

01/17/2008 03:13:49 PM

Can I add... If, as president, Huckabee will work to make gay marriage illegal, then he is saying that the government can say who can and who cannot get married. He is in essence turning it into a government contract rather than a religious one because he is taking that right away from religious institutions. Therefore, Huckabee would work against his own base. Shekah

nnmns

01/17/2008 03:03:25 PM

"The only reason the government would get involved [in things like hunger and homelessness] would be that the other social institutions – primarily the family the church the neighborhood – failed. If the family or church does its own work and does it well, then there’s no reason for government to ever get into these things at all. The ideal is that they wouldn’t, that they’ll do a lousy job of it generally." Does this mean he'd do away with federal programs against hunger and federal housing programs? If so, we need to be sure before we vote, if not he needs to clarify his words.

bristlecone77

01/17/2008 03:02:17 PM

NNMS said "Huckabee seems to be very self-centered." Yes, that's true. Claiming to speak for God does indicate a bit of an ego problem, wouldn't you say? Shekah

nnmns

01/17/2008 02:55:48 PM

"...people come up and say, “I’m praying for you. How can I pray?” And I always tell them to pray the prayer of Isaiah 54 – no weapons formed against me will be able to prosper." Aren't there more important things for people to be praying for than for him to be assassin-proof? How about world peace? Ending hunger? That the best person be elected president? Huckabee seems to be very self-centered. Kind of like GWB.

bristlecone77

01/17/2008 02:54:31 PM

I didn't know Bush was actually the most Christian president in history. I thought the worship of money and power was forbidden in Christianity. Shekah

nnmns

01/17/2008 02:50:58 PM

There's so much to say about Huckabee. Let's begin by pointing out that no president in decades, if not ever, was more Christian than George W. Bush is. Evangelicals and fundamentalists supported him in droves and are generally "credited" with his becoming president. And of course George W. Bush lied/played incredibly loosely with the facts to get us into a war that has hurt us a lot and empowered our enemies, he ignored our world ("creation" to some) till recently; now he gives it lip service but won't do very much that his industrial supporters think might harm their economic interests. And he's been divisive, very divisive in time of war when we should be working together. My point is that making a person being very Christian is no reason to think they will make a good or even moral president. Comments on Huckabee to follow.

bristlecone77

01/17/2008 02:37:16 PM

I think Sodom and Gomorrah is the America Huckabee would make. The Bible only says they were wicked, not that they were homosexual. That was taken way out of context. It is wicked to destroy the rights of women. If women have no rights then heterosexual sex is statutory rape. It is wicked to claim your morality greater than love and take power to enforce it. It is wicked to quarantine the AIDS victims instead of caring for them and allowing them access to loved ones. Be careful what you ask for. A world leader forcing their religious beliefs on others will turn this place into a wicked place. Shekah

Apokalypsis

01/17/2008 02:30:25 PM

I agree 100% with Governor Huckabee and believe that he would make a GREAT president! If anyone truly studied the Bible they would agree with him too. Remember Sodom and Gomorrah. He got my vote. 24 Then the LORD rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the LORD out of heaven; 25 And he overthrew those cities, and all the plain, and all the inhabitants of the cities, and that which grew upon the ground. Genesis 19:24-25

bristlecone77

01/17/2008 11:57:15 AM

While I respect Huckabee's interest in helping the poor, that is the only thing I see that is particularly ethical or Christian about him. I left a Christianity much like his because it was so full of hate and lies that later on the lies that took hold nearly killed me. That version of Christianity has soiled the religion in my eyes and it is a war in myself to not cringe every time I hear Jesus's name. What Huckabee wants is an extremely narrow philosophy government based on his extremely selective interpretation of the Bible. I will not live in the country he will make. I will stand against it. Shekah

Do_unto_others

01/17/2008 10:54:39 AM

frgough, "homosexuals can marry now. Any homosexual who wants to can marry any willing member of the opposite sex. So, what exactly is your argument?" The argument is, WHY ON EARTH WOULD WE WANT TO? The Christian tenet is to do to others as we would have done to ourselves. If the situation were reversed, would YOU want to be forced to marry someone of the same sex??? The other argument is the ALL citizens are (supposedly) guaranteed the right to life, LIBERTY (and what you propose is certainly NO 'liberty') and the pursuit of happiness. Forcing gay people to marry someone of the opposite sex is certain to result in the LACK of happiness, not in its achievement. Would YOU be happy marrying someone of the same sex? Thought not. The other argument is that the Huckster wants to enshrine HIS religious beliefs into the Constitution. That would make freedom of religion evaporate in the US.

tawonda

01/17/2008 10:39:55 AM

Speaking as a mainline, Lutheran Christian -- I intend to vote for a President, not a Pope. Huckabee's triumphalist ambitions to amend the Constitution to match his sectarian understanding of Scripture terrifies me. And shame on voters for encouraging him.

frgough

01/17/2008 10:39:10 AM

homosexuals can marry now. Any homosexual who wants to can marry any willing member of the opposite sex. So, what exactly is your argument?

Icelander

01/17/2008 09:33:35 AM

I've never understood how preventing people who want to get married from doing so is "protecting marriage." Why not let homosexuals marry and simply outlaw divorce?

TanyaMD27

01/17/2008 07:54:08 AM

I am sure that Huckabee is a nice man but I personally do not feel comfortable with someone who wants to change our government, rules and constitution based on the Bible. For one, there's the whole issue of separation of church and state and Huckabee comes across as someone who wants to turn the state into church. Another issue is that not everyone in this country is Christian. What about the Jewish, Muslim, Atheist, Wiccan, Buddhist, etc citizens. As a woman, the thought of having someone who is so far to the right take office and tell me what I can and cannot do with my body (i.e. abortion, birth control, sex education) scares me. In addition to all of that the man has no idea what he's talking about when it comes to foreign affairs. We need someone a little more well-rounded. Huckabee is just not the right man for the job. Just my opinion. :)

namchuck

01/16/2008 10:11:35 PM

Huckabee, and the other religiously inclined candidates, should keep their personal superstitions out of politics. I wouldn't want a president, convinced of the truth of biblical prophecy, anywhere near the button that might initiate Armageddon.

protestant_irish

01/16/2008 07:12:20 PM

Huckabee seem like nice chap, but if he baptist his views can be very narrow. He does not seem to want to meet in the middle on simple topic let alone big ones. I never vote republican anyways, but he left the church for devil's work.If was minister his true devotional should be preaching the gospel of the lord thy God.

namchuck

01/16/2008 06:43:54 PM

Good posts bristlecone77 and Do_unto_others!

Do_unto_others

01/16/2008 05:09:28 PM

Changing the Constitution ("amending" it implies it is being made "better") is not necessary to "affirm marriage". I affirm it and I am a gay man, a married gay man. My marriage was affirmed before God in my Church. What the Huckster REALLY means is that he wants to affirm only SOME people's marriages.

Do_unto_others

01/16/2008 05:09:10 PM

Will this man not STOP his lies??? "I don’t think that’s a radical view to say we’re going to affirm marriage. I think the radical view is to say that we’re going to change the definition of marriage so that it can mean two men, two women, a man and three women, a man and a child, a man and animal." Such fear-mongering. Of course, no one IS saying that. Pedophiliac and bestial "marriages" are NOT what is being discussed. This man sure seems to have a lot of hate in his heart to say such vile, mean-spirited things about God's lgbt children. I only HOPE Americans can see right thru his phony baloney. "Again, once we change the definition, the door is open to change it again. I think the radical position is to make a change in what’s been historic." Um, historically in America, it was 1 WHITE man and 1 WHITE woman, or 1 black man and 1 black woman. THAT definition got changed, and rightly so.

Do_unto_others

01/16/2008 04:58:47 PM

"Marriage has historically, as long as there’s been human history, meant a man and a woman in a relationship for life." Yet more false witness. In many, many societies - even Biblical ones - it has been 1 man, several women. In the Repubclican party, it is 1 man, 1 woman at a time. And hardly "for life". Perhaps Huck could tell his other nominees who haven't followed this supposed 1 man, 1 woman for life ideal themselves before he starts pointing his finger at gays. A selective fundamentalist at best, a prejudiced ani-Constitutionalist at worst. This theocrat must be stopped.

Do_unto_others

01/16/2008 04:55:15 PM

"people sometimes say we shouldn’t have a ... marriage amendment because the Constitution is far too sacred to change" What an absolute CROCK. That is NOT the reason we say it shouldn't be changed to exclude gay citizens. The Constitution guarnatees equal treatment for ALL citizens before the law. This 'change' would make heinous exceptions to that 'guarantee' for God's gay and lesbian citizens. The 'sacredness' (if ther be any) in the Constitution is NOT in its 'inability to be changed' but that it covers ALL people. That the Huckster would start excluding SOME citizens from its purview is disgusting and, imnsho, anti-Christian if, to be Christian means to do to others as you would have them do to yourself. How would Huckabee feel if HE were excluded from the Constitution's protections? This is just so sad in a would-be President.

Do_unto_others

01/16/2008 04:50:05 PM

'The Lord Truly Gave Me Wisdom' In Huckabee's own, not very humble opinion. Many others of us would disagree. Strongly.

bristlecone77

01/16/2008 01:29:47 PM

Beware of any human being who claims to speak for God. This has happened since time began and, except for extremely rare situations, has had unpleasant consequences for those influenced. Ego and God are not the same thing. Shekah

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