John McCain: Constitution Established a 'Christian Nation'

He expresses discomfort about a Muslim in the White House and says he won't undergo a full-immersion baptism while campaigning.

frdmtochoose

05/27/2010 12:44:05 PM

We have a fox in the henhouse. Obama is from a Muslim background. If we were not at war with people of the Islamic faith, then maybe it wouldn't be a problem. I voted for McCain, based on his military experience, his time in the Whitehouse, and his Pro-American mentality. As soon as I saw Obama's name, I said, "this is not good". As to date, we still don't know from where he came. Every religion is subject to it's own interpritation by those who follow it. Every religion is a "cult". It's sad that so many people can be "brain-washed" by so-called leaders of a cult. Jimmy Jones is a good example. We, as Americans, have the freedom to believe whatever we want. People just need to stop trying to convince everyone else that their religion is the right one or the best one. The Muslim religion is supposed to be about peace and love, as is most religions. But there are those radicals who want to twist the writings of their faith into a rebellious and hateful rhetoric, and to entice others to believe the same. And to believe that anyone else who does not share in their beliefs, should be eliminated, is surely a sign of their warped mentality. Their altimate goal is to control the world with their stupid beliefs and they're getting a foothold in a lot of countries. We certainly don't need more Muslims in America with all the bleeding heart defenders here, just like we don't need more Mexicans, Cubans, Haitians, etc. We cannot save the world by bringing everyone here. Our country is in a state of collapse because of trying to support the rest of the world. It's time we take care of ourselves first. America should be totally independant for food and natural resources. Only then can we help others.

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Rayah

01/18/2009 02:52:55 PM

It is a fact that our Founding Fathers were not Christians. It is a fact that our country was not founded as a Christian Nation. It is a fact that the government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion. The Amendments to the Constitution of the United States says in Amendment I, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof: or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

rajid

06/09/2008 04:07:16 PM

Our Founding Fathers were NOT Christian: //freethought.mbdojo.com/foundingfathers.html Our country was not founded as a "Christian Nation": //freethought.mbdojo.com/foundingfathers.html And I quote Washington's treaty with Tripoly 1797: "...the government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion." History: Learn it and stop making it up!

rajid

06/09/2008 04:06:27 PM

Our Founding Fathers were NOT Christian: Our country was not founded as a "Christian Nation": And I quote Washington's treaty with Tripoly 1797: "...the government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion." History: Learn it and stop making it up!

jameswol

06/04/2008 10:14:04 PM

John McCain is a complex man with complex ideas about the world and Iraq. While John McCain, like Bush, seems to sometimes distort the truth, at least Bush has a clear devotion. I'm just not sure if John McCain truly has a true Christian belief on stances like abortion or homosexuality. John McCain also, with his lobbyist ties, just doesn't seem to have the ethics I'd want from a true Christian. I wish he would undergo a conversion of faith and truly commit to Christ.

imwilma

02/05/2008 03:08:51 PM

i would feel alot better if we had a president that consulted God on decisions he makes for me and our country. I would feel better with a president that would stand up for christian rights instead of athiest rights and stop taking "God" out of everything because the athiest are offended! Let our new president work to keep "God" in our business, because I as a Christian I am offended that he is so easily taken out. I think our country would be a lot better if we had a president that was not afraid to hit his knees and humble himself before the only person that can truely help him get our country back on it's feet! Without God, we are doomed!

romneygirl

02/05/2008 11:44:08 AM

Romney anyone?

protestant_irish

01/21/2008 08:59:54 PM

Personal first of all Sentor McCain is war hero and service this great nation. Nevertheless he abanned his wife who was even loyalto him when he was pow camp. She could have move on and marry another man. She did not because she was classy. He is the lowest form of man, if there any. He left her when she was in car accdient and lost her look. So if this is ture is no real hero he just a fake. McCain is really noy much of christian, if look at that event. he has no class and no one should vote for him, if this the case. Could this be a rumor, i have not hear other wise. America maybe was Christian influnce mayb, but most of founder fathers were not tradtional christian by any means of the word. God bless America and the great people of American. Vote obama your mama this coming nov.

TheWhiteHart

10/14/2007 11:06:51 AM

It doesn't matter what religion the President is. The only thing that matters is: Will be uphold and protect the Constitution of the United States and enforce her laws. End of story.

ceveazey

10/13/2007 08:10:34 PM

The United States is not a Christian when it goes after other countries' resources. One of the 10 commandments is "Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's property."

ruvain

10/08/2007 05:02:17 PM

The Founding Fathers went out of their way to make it clear that America was NOT a Christian nation. The Founding Fathers intentionally and expressly set up a secular nation, and by the First Amendment, they forbide the government from interferring with private practice of religion and from the government's promoting religion -- any religion. Religion was left solely to the private realm. What part of "separation" is so difficult to comprehend? What gets me is people who think that G-d is so weak that She cannot function unless She can meddle in politics.

BillThinks4Himself

10/07/2007 05:43:22 PM

John McCain is a such a hot windbag. He is so willing to sell his soul for a vote that I'm just going to have to give my vote to someone else. He's not acting like a man who belongs at the top of the GOP. He's acting like Pat Buchanan. Stupid, stupid, stupid.

MoonGlory

10/07/2007 03:41:21 PM

If we want to have truly informed discussions about the role of faith in politics we can never truly do so until we have addressed the silence in regards to those public office holders who do have Masonic ties and the possible implications of this point.

MoonGlory

10/07/2007 03:40:37 PM

I think he does, and he's just doing a song and dance for the masses of sheep who don't know any better...he is probably very aware that this country was really founded by men who's true alliance was secretly couched in their Masonic ties...and up until today I've never heard any of them stand up and say I'm a Christian Mason or such...This country was founded by Masons and are still ran by Masons for the most part...but no reporter will ask hem about that because they know they will probably be tasered and carried off like that young man in Florida that confronted John Kerry with a question about his Masonic beliefs in a open public forum.

MoonGlory

10/07/2007 03:39:16 PM

It's really sad how these politicians get all holy when they are about to take a swing at office. Another thing that bothers me is this attempt to make the "In God We Trust" some kind of exclusive Christian belief...is this guy kidding me? Does he know how many religions pre-date Christianity that have this same belief as well as others that he tries to pinpoint as only a Christian.

popaface

10/06/2007 11:10:10 PM

What I believe was of central importance to understanding Jesus is to understand that he spoke of a radical kingdom of God --which completely negated the Roman empire-- this means that if you follow Jesus, you no longer live under the leadership of "Caesar" (Bush, Romney, John Howard, Hugo Chavez, Nelson Mandella, etc), and you enter into the dominion of God. This means more than just saying "God is king" or "Jesus is lord", it means conforming to their image. So conform to the image of the God of peace, justice and righteousness. If you do that, THEN you call Jesus lord. Remember, many will say "Lord! Lord!" but will not do what Jesus requires. I get skeptical of anyone who says, "Jesus is republican" or "Jesus is liberal", Jesus is radical! Jesus is a complete negation of social boundaries. Jesus is about the last being first, about the destitute inheriting the earth, about the "least of these" being empowered. Cheers, Allan

popaface

10/06/2007 11:09:27 PM

When Jesus said, "Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's and unto God what is God's" he meant give "everything" to God - because "everything" belongs to God in his Judaic religion. When Jesus discounted the Temple and the Jewish priests, it didn't mean that he discounted the Jewish religion, it meant that he wanted to reform the Jewish religion and show what it means to truly be Israel, in the words of N. T. Wright. Cheers, Allan

saadaya

10/05/2007 11:14:19 AM

How ignorant of what Jesus said he is. "Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's and unto God what is God's". Jesus was a secularist and a liberal. He did not trust priesthoods, he did not trust giving power to priests. In Matthew 23 he calls them vipers, hypocrites, 'greedy dogs who do not eat nor do they let other eat'. Pretty strong language. Clearly, he would not have given the keys to his house to a breed of greedy dogs or vipers.

DEUCEPREZ

10/05/2007 09:03:07 AM

Whenever I see the silly, baited statement, ...."this country [U.S.] was founded on Christian principles", I ask the person to identity what Christian principle are. Then I ask them to identify the principles of other religions. A vast majority of them are the same, whether they know them or not! In the meantime, most of the U.S. presidents and "founding fathers" were Masons and Shriners and had FULL KNOWLEDGE of Islàm in the practices of these organizations. They studied the Holy Qur'àn!

MamaTherese

10/03/2007 01:25:32 PM

James Madison: "The purpose of separation of church and state is to keep forever from these shores the ceaseless strife that has soaked the soil of Europe in blood for centuries." -1803 letter objecting use of Gov. land for churches Period. ;)

costrel

10/03/2007 10:26:19 AM

Last time I checked, the Constitution makes no reference to a deity of any kind. The Declaration of Independence mentions a deity in three places ("Nature's God," "their Creator," and "Divine Providence"), but that is not a part of the Constituion.

iane73

10/02/2007 10:00:26 PM

George Wallace originally ran on a liberal integrationist platform and was routed. Afterwards he swore never to be "outnigga-ed again". I wonder when I look at Maccains switch if he swore "never to be religious righted agai'. Once more, just MHO

iane73

10/02/2007 09:49:45 PM

I remember liking JM a lot more in 2000. He seems to have slid considerably to the right. Was he always this conservative? It looks like he is calculating politically rather then being willing to stand up and not be counted. Just my thoughts

TonyCoyote

10/02/2007 06:18:53 PM

I like how McCain tried to "clarify" by saying he was referring to principles our founding fathers held, like being against murder, etc. I hate when Christians say things like this, because since when was refraining from murder and other universally "bad" things universally Christian? Millenia before Christiany came about and before Jews even became monotheistic human beings held social principles that supported as harmonious a society as could be hoped for. We could just as easily say that America is founded on the principles of the Code of Hammurabi. Claiming universal human principles as being specifically Christian oriented is the greatest arrogance and I find it flat out offensive.

FutureShy

10/02/2007 04:06:10 PM

BREAKING ENTERTAINMENT NEWS: Sandra Bullock and Kenau Reeves have just signed on for Speed 3!! Co-starring [drum roll]...John McCain as himself! The stars are trapped on McCain's "Straight Talk Tour Bus"...incredible special effects galore as McCain FLIP-FLOPS his bus again and again as he clarifies, re-clarifies and clarifies his re-clarifications his latest remarks intended to flatter, fawn over and otherwise brownnose the fundamentalist elite and offend and disgust everyone else! Coming soon to a bottom tier theater, hopefully VERY far away from you!!

FutureShy

10/02/2007 03:57:21 PM

The blending of religion and politics is back in the headlines. Again... The extremes on this subject can be found in two recent stories: the protests being led by Buddhist monks in Myanmar, and John McCain's increasingly absurd pandering to the religious right... The monks are using religion to unite and inspire people against a brutal regime; McCain is using it to divide people for transient political gain. -- Arianna Huffington (part of her outstanding commentary on McCain's pathetic attempts to be the religious right's #1 toadie.)

RisingRon48

10/02/2007 02:57:28 PM

I went to the United Church of Christ and did a quick scan of the site regarding the Church's position on our war against Iraq civilians. From what I see; this is a Christ based philosophy regarding this war. I salute a church who is vocal about stopping the killing of innocents. Blessings. Ron

deserteagl1

10/02/2007 11:54:21 AM

atlantatom30306 et al. Excellent post(s) regarding Sen. McCain's comments. Sometimes Sen. McCain speaks without having his thoughts all in order...as do many others who comment on the idea of America being a "Christian Nation." In addition to what has been said of our Founders, one might also add the influence of the Masons, many of whom were Masons. The Masons, as I understand it, do not require a belief in the "Christian God" per se but on a higher being. There is little doubt that the Founders were thinking more in Judeo-Christian terms regarding values, morals, etc., but they understood the overall issue quite well based on their keen understanding of history. Each person's religion should remain just that-- his or her's own chosen religious vehicle for their respective spiritual journey through this life. Whatever negative impact(s) such journeys have on our overall society is a matter for Government to determine. The "positives" should take care of themselves.

tomwadsworth

10/02/2007 11:44:43 AM

This video interview with McCain was excellent. I thank BeliefNet for doing this and asking these appropriate and probing questions.

atlantatom30306

10/02/2007 10:40:17 AM

The reason that Christians are so confused on this issue is that, from their perspective, Jesus and God are one. The occasional use of the word God by writers of the Constitution (for example) does not in any way lead directly to the understanding of this country as a Christian nation. In fact, the main framers of the Constitution and the principles on which we were founded were, for the most part, Diests. Jefferson, Franklin, Paine, and many others were influenced by the ideals of the Enlightenment - a time that was focused on spiritual exploration and scientific fact. Yes, several of the other main contributors were also Christian. No doubt that references to God and "your maker", etc. did, indeed mean Jesus. But the fact that this document referencing a creator was written by people with very different beliefs, and each knew the other did not share their beliefs, is the true representation of of our heritage. A heritage that is being hurt by those who claim it only represents their beliefs.

DolphynHeart

10/02/2007 09:02:04 AM

Sorry, I meant, hang, or drown witches, not burn, I don't believe they did that. Our founding fathers were not idiots, they were smart back then, and saw the problems that could arise by bringing Church and State together. So that is why SEPARTATION OF CHURCH AND STATE should be respected by all.

DolphynHeart

10/02/2007 08:59:36 AM

CreedofCrusaders, You desperately need a history lesson, let me give it to you: Pilgrims came to American after England basicly kicked them out, England was a Christian nation by that time, but not Puritans by any means....and of course, Pilgrims could burn "witches" in American at the time, where noone could stop them.

DolphynHeart

10/02/2007 08:49:06 AM

Another "Christain" putting down other faiths. No surprise it is from a Republican of course. Jesus himself must be "rolling in his grave" to see such bigots claiming to follow His religion. And the U.S was NOT founded on Christianity at ALL, you won't find that anywhere. "God" does not mean Christainity, it means faith, period. Oh, Jesus, save us from your "followers".

JayjJacobs

10/02/2007 08:34:59 AM

Pandering & Posturing backfire on McCain: Is he just showing off? Or mimicking Fundamentalists' 'Chapter & Verse' speaking when he cites the Four Gospels by name? Doesn't he know that "the Nativity Story" he claims to have read in The Four is only in TWO of the Gospels? Luke gives the account of the Shepherds & the Newborn in the Manger, while Matthew tells of the Magi (astrologers) arriving In Jerusalem before meeting the Child & parents in a House in Bethlehem. Another pseudo-intellectual goof is his reference to "the Greek god hubris" -- there is no such entity. 'Hubris' was a social crime, not a theological one. It was crowing over a loser (as if in a cockfight); in modernity, 'adding insult to injury'. For fastest verification Check Wikipedia. And any Christian Bible. Of course, McCain doesn't recognize the Judeo-Christian origins of Islam. Mainline Muslims revere Abraham, and especially Jesus, as a Major Prophet, leading up to Mohammed. Mazeltov, JayjJacobs

eric_m_allen

10/02/2007 01:03:55 AM

>>Obama is not a Christian, he is a Black Muslim, a member of the Nation of Islam. That would be false. Check your facts. He's a UCC. http://www.ucc.org/news/barack-obama-candidate.html

Richard-ELCA

10/02/2007 12:28:59 AM

Personally, I don't care what religion or denomination or sect a president is or whether or not the president has any religion. This is all quite beside the point. The issue is whether the person can do the job or not. America a Christian nation? Well, I don't know about that since much of our history is filled with things which aren't exactly what I'd call Christian endeavors. One of them, of course, is war. We seem to love being at war. Not exactly the Gospel now, is it?

WarVeteran

10/01/2007 11:07:04 PM

To ms_sara, Obama is not a Christian, he is a Black Muslim, a member of the Nation of Islam. His name is Muslim. Do you know his middle name? A hint: It is the first name of the former dictator of Iraq. To penny8248, The phrase "Separation of Church and State" is not a basic principle in the Declaration of Independence nor the Constitution. YOu might read both documents, they are available on the WEB just as Belifnet. For the Constitution, it basically states "That Congress shall make no laws favoring a religion". Today, I don't know of any law favoring a religion, if there is let me know. Congress has a Chaplain that opens each secession of Congress with a prayer. This does not violate the Constitution, becasue it the not a law of the land but a Congressional house rule. This is a typical liberal slant on the Constitution. Read something in to it that does not exist.

channing_uu

10/01/2007 05:28:07 PM

No found father ever carried a coin that said "In God We Trust". That is a 20th century addendum to our currency. And yet, McCain holds it up as further evidence that we are a christian nation... These interviews look like the words of a desperate man

Nonfundie

10/01/2007 03:16:49 PM

Barry Goldwater is turning over in his grave. I was a big supporter of McCain until just a few months ago. The Straight Talk Express has permanently pulled into the amusement park.

eastcoastlady

10/01/2007 12:50:49 PM

ms_sara, Depends on how you look at it. From my understanding, he wanted a return to very strict Talmudic principles and wanted more open religious observance, so you can look at it more than one way. Either way, McCain has lost any credibility he might ever have had, with me, at least.

ms_sara

10/01/2007 11:55:00 AM

Do we have a Muslim running for president? Obama is Christian. And by the way... what Christian principles is America founded on? Wasn't Jesus a bleeding heart liberal?

eastcoastlady

10/01/2007 09:29:26 AM

Dear NightLad, Thank you so much for your kind reminder how to post bold, italics, underline, etc. I feel a little silly having forgotten...

WomanoftheCelts

10/01/2007 02:00:08 AM

I have voted for John McCain in every election since I moved to Arizona in 1986. I beleived in him as both a VietNam Vet, and as a good representative of the State of Arizona. He decided this year to make a run for president again, and I am so sorry I ever voted for him before. I have never seen anyone pander to a group of people as John McCain has to the religious right. America a Christian nation? Perhaps, but the Constitution didn't make it so, people did. The Constitution calls for strict seperation of church and state by not allow the government to set up any form of government based religion. John, I think you had better re-read the Constitution before opening your mouth and putting your foot in it again. Shame on you. This is one Democrat who is fed up with the Republican pandering to the religious right. Being an Episcopalian, I am not obliged to leave my brains at the door of the church. and therefore have decided that I will not vote for you again, under ANY circumstances!

mightymountaingorilla

09/30/2007 11:46:07 PM

I take particular offense to his comment that he would think of being Christian as a qualification for running this nation, since it was founded on Christian principles. I cannot believe that he would discount any candidate on the mere fact that they aren't Christian. What? No person brought up in another religion could be competent to understand the mindset of the USA and its laws? As a person who was raised outside of Christianity and yet love this country with all of my heart, I am deeply offended by these remarks. All things now considered, I will not be voting for McCain, even if he (by some miracle) gets the republican nomination.

mightymountaingorilla

09/30/2007 11:46:00 PM

I read this article yesterday and it took me a long while to really contemplate the degree of offense that McCain has just caused me to feel. I have been a long time McCain supporter, having consistently trusted his judgment on many issues (e.g. torture), but have primarily admired his reliance on intelligence and truth to prevail across party lines. However, his pandering to gain republican votes has completely destroyed his credibility with many democrats and moderates. (cont.)

BillThinks4Himself

09/30/2007 10:18:51 PM

I'm disappointed with McCain who is clearly more interested in votes than he is in truth. He's ruining his reputation as a straight shooter. It's a historic fact that the Constitution does NOT endorse any religion. While most Americans at the time were Anglican Christians, the Constitution makes no references to Christianity or Jesus. It specifically prohibits any religious tests for public office. In pandering to the religious right, McCain demeans the Constitution by making it sound like ours is similar to that of an Islamic theocracy. Their constitutions specifically state that their society - and law - should serve a specific religion. Ours does not.

penny8248

09/30/2007 09:04:08 PM

One of the most basic principles in the Declaration of Independence was the SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND STATE. Apparently our political parties no longer recognize this as theocratic measures have come about. Government should not have any role in establishing standards and rules that regulate social morality and what is considered legitimate and not legitimate. The American people have turned into flocks of sheep that follow its shepards.

FutureShy

09/30/2007 08:38:46 PM

Sorry, right click on the hypertext below and Open Link in New Window. McCain reminds me of Dwight Schrute of "The Office" - both are sniveling yes-men with no true values or ideals, who both DEPERATELY want to be loved, valued and accepted: Dwight by his self-important, delusions-of-grandeur boss Michael Scott (Steve Carell), and McCain by the self-important, delusions-of-grandeur religious ultra-right. Talk about life imitating art! Sen. Dwight -- oops I mean Sen. McCain: YOU ARE IN A HOLE. STOP DIGGING!

FutureShy

09/30/2007 08:26:35 PM

In Bnet's softball interview, McCain pathetic pandering to America's Christian far right extremists in what has resulted in McCain desperately trying to wipe the egg off his face, but instead he has made a bigger fool out of himself.

Bravo88

09/30/2007 06:59:27 PM

Hey dragonhearted, Talking about slapping? I hope you're just venting 'cause that sounds like a threat of violence. I don't know McCain from the frozen pie company but...would you rather people voted for Bush? or Bush's successor (handpicked one that is)? Unfortunately, we've got wackos in Ca. too - Mulroney was one of the worst, Chretien was just a little porky dictator (apologies to pigs everywhere). Yup - Tmarie64 is probably correct that the US (and Canada) isn't Christian - they have Christian values expressed in their documents perhaps but the governments behaviour (especially towards the natives) has been closer to either fascist or communist-dictatorial. How? Well, the treatment of the natives approximates the treatment by the Soviets of the Jewish people and their own people. Full scale movements of people, killings, persecution etc are just some of the ways that US (Canada too) have mistreated the natives.

DragonHearted

09/30/2007 05:25:38 PM

There are no words in any language to express the level of idiocy that McCain has just shown. I mean, I wasn't going to vote for him before but now I think I am going to personally hunt down and slap anyone who says they would.

Tmarie64

09/30/2007 08:13:28 AM

We are NOT a "christian" nation. We are specifically a freedom nation. The founding fathers specifically stated that the government would establish NO STATE RELIGION. They didn't mean none but Xtian. I'd have huge problems with a Mormon president because I don't want a president that has to run his ideas past his church elders. Women get little enough respect as it is, without having a president and his wife who believe we should all stay in our "place".

sohailstyle

09/30/2007 02:35:05 AM

Hmmmm

III-Timothy

09/29/2007 09:31:28 PM

McCann would do well to read a new book - What do Evangelical Christians Believe? - before further embarrasing himself. (The book is available on Amazon and Barnes and Noble websites.)

NightLad

09/29/2007 06:20:40 PM

BNet uses for the HTML stuff, hun. :-)

eastcoastlady

09/29/2007 06:02:06 PM

It's great to have faith and all, but to delude oneself into thinking it's written into or intended by the Constitution; well, that's just /u/sad/u/.

eastcoastlady

09/29/2007 05:59:14 PM

It would be a cold day in hell (pun (i)perhaps(i) intended) before I'll pay any more attention to this man (b)running for President!! (/b) who so clearly has no clue about the Constitution, the very document he would be sworn to uphold. Apologies in advance if I may have forgotten how to bold, italizice, etc - it's been a while since I've posted...

americanexperiment

09/29/2007 05:43:05 PM

Please. Anybody would learn in a college freshman-level history course (maybe even high school if you are lucky enough to have a "rebel" teacher) that America was founded be Deists and based on Enlightenment principles, certainly not Christian.

KWinters

09/29/2007 02:57:15 PM

Now we know for sure McCain is full of crap and willing to lie to get votes or he's completely ignorant of American history: TREATY OF PEACE AND FRIENDSHIP BETWEEN THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AND THE BEY AND SUBJECTS OF TRIPOLI OF BARBARY ARTICLE 11 As the government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion,4 - as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion or tranquility of Musselmen, - and as the said States never have entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mehomitan nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries. Treaty signed at Tripoli November 4, 1796, and at Algiers January 3, 1797 ...Proclaimed by the President of the United States June 10, 1797

usama

09/29/2007 12:25:18 PM

I take no offense by his bigotry. Its certainly sad pandering. Katherine Harris of 200 election infamy said the exact same thing when she ran for US senator here. But by that time, even the GOP abandoned her. The thing is, many GOP elite have ties to the Saudis and Gulf emirates via banking, business, etc. So making that kind statement shows how far out of power he is.

danbee46

09/29/2007 11:54:34 AM

In 1797 America made a treaty with Tripoli, declaring that "the government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion." This reassurance to Islam was written under Washington's presidency, and approved by the Senate under John Adams. Take that, McCain!

NightLad

09/29/2007 11:26:08 AM

Creedofcrusades, This is a quote from James Madison, also known by historians as the "father of the constitution:" "The purpose of Separation of Church and State is to keep forever from these shores the ceaseless strife that has soaked the soil of Europe in blood for centuries." - James Madison, 1803 letter objecting use of Gov. land for churches Your quote comes from a compact made by the pilgrims that landed in Plymouth, who were Puritans - not all pilgrims who came to America. They were not even the first to arrive! A settlement had already been founded in Jamestown years earlier and they created no such statement. The Mayflower Compact was meant to govern their own Puritan community (and we see what a great job mixing Church & State did there! Burn any witches lately?) – not all of fledgling America. Unlike the Bill of Rights, or the Constitution, which do guarantee Religious Freedom – both yours, and mine.

Creedofcrusades

09/29/2007 08:44:59 AM

Um, they [Pilgrims] came here for something called RELIGIOUS FREEDOM, which is to "Christians" what garlic is to vampires. "Having undertaken for the Glory of God, and Advancement of the Christian Faith, and the Honour of our King and Country, a voyage to plant the first colony in the northern parts of Virginia..." Mayflower Compact 1620

lectrikmike

09/29/2007 03:50:49 AM

It seems that John McCain is getting really desperate. He's now pandering to the religious right crowd. He may as well stop emarassing himself and drop out of the running now. Although watching him undergo a full immersion baptism would be a bit of political parody worth seeing.

FutureShy

09/29/2007 12:34:20 AM

I would never vote for a President who wasn't a Christian. Hmmm, John Kerry is a Christian. id So...did you flip a coin in the last election? No, of course you didn't...because a "Christian" to folks like you requires not only ironclad belief in the virgin birth, resurrection of Jesus etc., but also ironclad belief in a set of dysfunctional political values too. You see, though the Constitution can forbid a legal religious test it cannot forbid our Christian nation from applying a religious test at eelction time. True, no one can stop you from committing intellectual suicide and voting for the most ideologically pure [cough cough] "Christian" you can find. Why else did the Pilgrims come to America but to found a Christian nation? Um, they came here for something called RELIGIOUS FREEDOM, which is to "Christians" what garlic is to vampires.

Creedofcrusades

09/28/2007 10:29:28 PM

I would never vote for a President who wasn't a Christian. You see, though the Constitution can forbid a legal religious test it cannot forbid our Christian nation from applying a religious test at eelction time. Why else did the Pilgrims come to America but to found a Christian nation?

Toyland

09/28/2007 09:58:36 PM

A recent poll found that 55 percent of Americans believe the U.S. Constitution establishes a Christian nation. What do you think? I would probably have to say yes, that the Constitution established the United States of America as a Christian nation.>> Hmmm. I read the US Constitution from cover to cover, and never saw anything about a "Christian nation." But I did see one provision that prohibited a religious test for anyone seeking public office. And I seem to recall something about no laws respecting the establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof. But if McCain wants votes, I guess he has to pander to the 55% majority that is clueless about the constitution, even as he seeks to take an oath to uphold that constitution.

di12381

09/28/2007 09:41:45 PM

It's funny, I thought we were an American nation, allowing all citizens to practice or not practice whatever religion we wish. Yes, this nation was founded on judeo-christian principles, however, I don't think the founding fathers ever envisioned the diversity of future generations. I just hope that our children and grandchildren still have that diversity in their lives.

FutureShy

09/28/2007 09:07:56 PM

Ah yes, John McCain...this is the same guy who, after being brutally slandered by the Bush in the 2000 campaign, called a spade a spade and railed against the religious right that controls the GOP. Now, seven long years later, he has allowed himself to be reduced to the religious right's heel-clicking, yes-man stooge. Yes, America is a "Christian nation", and we have the dead bodies, Enron-esque corrupt government, lost ideals, right wing hate media and "Jesus Camps" to prove it. We need a "President McCain" like Laura Bush needs another pack of smokes.

ZeusMM

09/28/2007 08:20:36 PM

Does McCain recall that a presidential candidate named Anderson once attempted to get Congress to declare the U.S. a Christian nation and lost his bid for election?

methodistsearching

09/28/2007 05:35:51 PM

McCain continues to troll the depths to see how low he can go. I thought W had set the bar for ridiculous pandering, but McCain seems committed to setting a new standard.

costrel

09/28/2007 05:03:21 PM

Would McCain be comfortable with an atheist president? Or a Buddhist president? Or how about a non-Chrsitian Native American? I for one am certainly tired of Christian Presidents.

bristlecone77

09/28/2007 04:13:16 PM

frgough, Where do you get this information? A Muslim, depending on who he or she is, would be okay in my book. Be careful about saying Christians seek a kingdom in Heaven, and Muslims seeking a kingdom on Earth. There are a lot of Muslims who strive to live a virtuous life and get to Heaven. And the right-wing Christians in charge of this country appear to be sacrificing the kingdom of Heaven for one on Earth. The big mega-churches, as well, look to be monuments to the human ego rather than monuments to God. Shekah

frgough

09/28/2007 03:18:03 PM

So many foolish and ignorant people. First, a Muslim in the white house would make me uncomfortable, too. People need to realize there is a fundamental difference between Islam and Christianity as religions and what they teach and espouse. Christianity seeks a kingdom in heaven. Islam seeks a kingdom on earth.

VElizabeth

09/28/2007 02:30:36 PM

Hm... I'm not registered as a democrat or republican but I have a feeling which way I'm going to vote, and this pretty much seals it. Too bad I can't find a country that lets people worship as they choose and doesn't demonize people for their beliefs. I love how he respects anyone that follows jesus, but no one else should get any respect.

greling

09/28/2007 12:54:15 PM

After looking like a total flip-flopper on the same-sex marriage issue, Mcain is trying his hardest to look "conservative" and appeal to the far right-wing nutballs. The only problem is... Those nutballs are becoming more and more discouraged and are realizing that they are being used. Meanwhile, young liberal voters are turning out in record numbers. They already voted Democratic majorities into both houses. If Mcain keeps it up, he'll not only lose face but lose his senate seat. Saying America was founded with Christian values is totally different that saying, "This is a Christian nation". Then again, I never knew that slavery and bigotry against women were "Christian" in any way.

NightLad

09/28/2007 12:42:56 PM

“Christian Nation”? Historian Barry Schwartz writes: "George Washington's practice of Christianity was limited and superficial because he was not himself a Christian... He repeatedly declined the church's sacraments. Never did he take communion, and when his wife, Martha, did, he waited for her outside the sanctuary... Even on his deathbed, Washington asked for no ritual, uttered no prayer to Christ, and expressed no wish to be attended by His representative." [New York Press, 1987, pp. 174-175] Thomas Paine: "I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish Church, Roman Church... Protestant Church, nor by any Church that I know of. My own mind is my own Church. Each of those churches accuse the other of unbelief; and for my own part, I disbelieve them all." James Madison: "The purpose of separation of church and state is to keep forever from these shores the ceaseless strife that has soaked the soil of Europe in blood for centuries." -1803 letter objecting use of Gov. land for churches

bristlecone77

09/28/2007 12:22:30 PM

So according to this idiot, this is a Christian nation. And then we race to the bottom as to who is most orthodox, who is more true to the faith until this country eats itself. Dear John McCain, if you want a theocracy, go live in Iran but leave my country alone. Shekah

TonyCoyote

09/28/2007 12:21:37 PM

If this is a Christian Nation in a legal sense, which is what McCain is saying when he claims that the Constitution establishes it as such, what does that say for non-Christians? Why should we continue to support and take part in the perpetuation of a governmental system founded on a religion we do not believe in? If this were a Christian nation as is claimed, that would put us in the same position as Christians in Muslim theocracies. In actuality, this country has been officially and legally proclaimed a nation NOT founded on Christianity, as per the Treaty of Tripoli. It stupifies me that politicians can say things like this that alienate political and social involvement by non-Christians and there is no outcry.

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